Special Ops Paintball: AR Build - Special Ops Paintball

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AR Build

#61 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 12:45 AM

I was reading some and came across this.

http://battlecomp.com/
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#62 User is offline   MaDuce 

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 01:15 AM

Nice, I think they borrowed footage from this guy:


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#63 User is offline   nvghostrider 

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 09:51 PM

I have no issues using pretty much anything from a reputable company. I cheaped out on my utility rifle build and just used an old DPMS lower we've used for testing in the last four years. If it works why waste ammo money on useless frills.

Rock River pissed me off. I wanted to get one of their Coyote rifles and a 1911 but being so popular it was pretty much impossible. Thanks Rock River for being affordable and stupid desirable.
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#64 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 09:01 AM

That is an amazing video.

Thinking ahead, coupled mags for home defense? Yay nay?
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#65 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 10:57 AM

Maybe, but I wouldn't. The only way I'd consider it is if all my mags were paired off like that, and I had pouches suitable for carrying them that way.

Though in the case of strictly home defense, transferring to pistol is going to be faster than any rifle magazine reload, including a mag coupler setup.
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#66 User is offline   LoD 

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 06:14 PM

Eh, I don't mean any offense Will, but why on earth would you need coupled mags for home defense? If you can't hit the guy with a full mag of .223/5.56, then there are a few issues right there already. I personally am not a fan of AR's for home defense. Too much penetration I would imagine. That's one reason why shotguns are recommended for home defense over pistols and rifles. I just don't see the need for coupled mags for home defense unless we're at a civil war and you have to defend your home from a lot of people. lol.

Again, I don't mean any offense. I just think if you can't hit the guy with a full mag of .223, think of where all of those stray bullets are going. Shooting through the walls into a neighbors house? Your baby's room? Now to double that with the coupled mag... I don't know.. Just my thoughts.

Edit: Also, got a call from my local store. I can get that RRA AR I posted for $909. Not bad for what you get.

This post has been edited by LoD: 29 November 2010 - 07:09 PM


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#67 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 07:30 PM

First, I must say MaDuce, that song is appropriate for that clip. Good find.

On to the technical...


View PostLoD, on 29 November 2010 - 07:14 PM, said:

I personally am not a fan of AR's for home defense. Too much penetration I would imagine. That's one reason why shotguns are recommended for home defense over pistols and rifles. I just don't see the need for coupled mags for home defense unless we're at a civil war and you have to defend your home from a lot of people. lol.


Hurricane Katrina, New England blackouts, Haiti earthquake, Mumbai terrorist hit....

Point is stuff does go wrong all the time. Maybe not every year, and maybe not at all in your area in your lifetime. But best to have the stuff on hand just in case.

Now, that said, I agree two coupled mags for standard HD is ridiculous. But I see nothing wrong with having a lot of mags for your AR (or AK if you're like Pistolwhipped).

As for penetration, believe it or not that shotgun is going to penetrate quite a bit too. When it comes to that close a distance for gunfighting, it no longer is about not overpenetrating and rather putting as many holes in the bad guy as you can in the shortest time possible. A shotgun does this with excellence, but so can an AR or a pistol in the right hands. It all depends on what you can afford and what works best for you. If Joe New Guy to self defense can only afford one gun, I'll tell him to get a pistol because it has greatest immediate versatility, covering home defense, CCW, vehicle protection, etc. If he can afford two, I'll tell him to get a pistol and an AR/AK because the AR/AK does a lot better with civil unrest and rioting and can also be used for hunting game if necessary. A 5.56 can be used to take anything from small game up to deer reliably with a good shooter. The "overpenetration" of the 5.56 or 7.62x39 in a HD scenario is tolerable in that case.

Shotguns have a niche role, yes. I even have one for that role. But on a tight budget, you can make do a lot better with an AR or AK than you can with a shotgun.

Quote

Again, I don't mean any offense. I just think if you can't hit the guy with a full mag of .223, think of where all of those stray bullets are going. Shooting through the walls into a neighbors house? Your baby's room? Now to double that with the coupled mag... I don't know.. Just my thoughts.

Edit: Also, got a call from my local store. I can get that RRA AR I posted for $909. Not bad for what you get.


Depending on house material, the 5.56 may not go into the neighbor's house. It depends on what it hits on the way. A 7.62x39 (or worse, a .308 or 7.62x54R) will penetrate through a lot more. But in all honesty, a twelve gauge round can punch through most cover a 5.56 can.

One of these days, when I have enough cash and time, I will go out to my family's farmland and film a "concealment/cover test," where I try shooting various common "cover" items including household materials with the main common calibers to see what happens. Pretty sure I know the outcome, but it's always a fun excuse to shoot stuff and it may help someone someday.
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#68 User is offline   nvghostrider 

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 09:56 PM

Quote

One of these days, when I have enough cash and time, I will go out to my family's farmland and film a "concealment/cover test," where I try shooting various common "cover" items including household materials with the main common calibers to see what happens. Pretty sure I know the outcome, but it's always a fun excuse to shoot stuff and it may help someone someday.


This is nothing but a juvenile reason to waste a ton of different ammo on various building materials and household items in some pursuit of enlightenment and sophomoric entertainment.

Nothing but deep fried sugary fun on a stick.

Be sure to mix in large animal bones, galvanized wiring conduit, melons of various sizes behind barriers, and a sink and/or tub if you can find a shootable one. VERY educational.
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#69 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 11:11 PM

My thinking isnt about the ammo at all, its about a gun malfunction and no one sleeps in a tac vest. Gun malfunctions, your spare mag is there.

To be honest, when I can get the money I want another 870. Changes from slug to buckshot for home defense seems to be a really good option. Haha.

This post has been edited by ghostinthewood: 29 November 2010 - 11:23 PM

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#70 User is offline   PistolWhipped 

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 07:47 AM

Actually, 5.56 has about the same penetration of interior walls as most 8 shot, and significantly less than any defensive shotgun round, as well as quite a bit less than many handgun rounds. At indoor ranges, the velocity is so high that the rounds tumble and fragment very quickly. There was a study on the Gun Talk Podcast.

Part A
http://guntalk.libsy...?post_id=502704

Part B
http://guntalk.libsy...?post_id=502705

Part C
http://guntalk.libsy...?post_id=502707

There are some Direct Download likes.

I still prefer a shotgun for HD, but .223 will work just fine.
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#71 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 08:43 AM

View Postnvghostrider, on 29 November 2010 - 10:56 PM, said:

This is nothing but a juvenile reason to waste a ton of different ammo on various building materials and household items in some pursuit of enlightenment and sophomoric entertainment.

Nothing but deep fried sugary fun on a stick.

Be sure to mix in large animal bones, galvanized wiring conduit, melons of various sizes behind barriers, and a sink and/or tub if you can find a shootable one. VERY educational.


1. No such thing as a "waste" of ammunition if you had fun shooting it.

2. Do you have a better way to get this information? Because often enough times variables people don't consider or other differences from the "traditional" defense make for a result differing from what you will say.

3. No need for the melons. You can go spend five seconds on youtube and find more than enough people have done that. Don't see much of a point in the others either.


View Postghostinthewood, on 30 November 2010 - 12:11 AM, said:

My thinking isnt about the ammo at all, its about a gun malfunction and no one sleeps in a tac vest. Gun malfunctions, your spare mag is there..


Good point on the malfunction, though with an AR a mag swap can also make the problem worse, depending on what the malfunction is. Often times, you are correct and it'll solve it, but so will tapping the bottom of the mag to get it re-seated right and re-chambering.

View PostPistolWhipped, on 30 November 2010 - 08:47 AM, said:

Actually, 5.56 has about the same penetration of interior walls as most 8 shot, and significantly less than any defensive shotgun round, as well as quite a bit less than many handgun rounds. At indoor ranges, the velocity is so high that the rounds tumble and fragment very quickly. There was a study on the Gun Talk Podcast.

Part A
http://guntalk.libsy...?post_id=502704

Part B
http://guntalk.libsy...?post_id=502705

Part C
http://guntalk.libsy...?post_id=502707

There are some Direct Download likes.

I still prefer a shotgun for HD, but .223 will work just fine.


Good find PW. I haven't been over there is a long time.
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#72 User is offline   Souleater 

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 01:26 PM

View Postghostinthewood, on 28 November 2010 - 02:45 AM, said:

I was reading some and came across this.

http://battlecomp.com/

Yes, the Battlecomp brakes are GtG. Apprently the company has very good customer relations as well. Lots of folks I 'know' really like them, and for many(with way to much money:laugh: ) it's as standard as a magazine. If I ever get a brake, this is where I'm going.
That being said, you probably really don't need one, especially starting out.

View PostThalion, on 29 November 2010 - 12:57 PM, said:

Maybe, but I wouldn't. The only way I'd consider it is if all my mags were paired off like that, and I had pouches suitable for carrying them that way.

View Postghostinthewood, on 30 November 2010 - 01:11 AM, said:

My thinking isnt about the ammo at all, its about a gun malfunction and no one sleeps in a tac vest. Gun malfunctions, your spare mag is there.

True- and from what I've looked at for chest rigs and such, even with double mag pouches I think it would be very hard to get coupled mags to fit.

The double mags for malfunction isn't a bad idea- actually I think it's pretty good.
Granted, most general malfunctions with an AR can be solved without removing the mag. But for, example, a double feed, where the standard response is to lock/strip/rack/reload, an extra mag would be handy. However, the question then becomes, will you have time to actually do said actions in a situation...?

Back to square one- if you really want to couple mags, try looking into a redimag (or redi-mod from BFG?) attachment for your gun. Much more handy than a coupler.

On a previous issue-
I strongly agree with a pistol/rifle combo. Pistol is just to useful to go without and (again) if only one gun could be obtained for defensive purposes it should be this. That being said, it's really only good to about 25/30 yds.. 50 if your a darn good shot, but I know I could never realistically do that. A shotgun is nice and the ability to switch up loads is useful, but still, we're talking an effective max of what- 75 yds. +/- (?). Whereas a rifle like the AR is useful at 200+ yards, and as mentioned is also a perfectly capable hunting tool. Imho, I agree,the shotgun
does have a useful place, and is not to be overlooked. But it would be foolish to go with solely limited-range weapons. Just my opinion.

This post has been edited by Souleater: 30 November 2010 - 01:26 PM

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#73 User is offline   LoD 

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 03:11 PM

Sorry Will, I guess I stand corrected. I was always under the impression that .223 was bad for HD because if you miss it would go through walls... But apparently I'm being told otherwise.. And just for the record, I wasn't telling him at all to get a shotgun over an AR. I was just simply stating I *thought* shotguns were better for HD.. But apparently not.

Thalion, I'm pretty sure ghostrider was joking :)

And you don't need 200 yds for home defense.. If you have to shoot someone at anyone near that range, it's clearly not home defense, it's going to be considered murder.. lol :)

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#74 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 03:31 PM

View PostLoD, on 30 November 2010 - 04:11 PM, said:

Sorry Will, I guess I stand corrected. I was always under the impression that .223 was bad for HD because if you miss it would go through walls... But apparently I'm being told otherwise.. And just for the record, I wasn't telling him at all to get a shotgun over an AR. I was just simply stating I *thought* shotguns were better for HD.. But apparently not.


Shotguns may well be better for HD for some people. Just not because of penetration issues.

My go-to gun in home defense is a shotgun (Saiga 12). For some people, I'd recommend a carbine. For some, a shotgun.

Personally, if I could avoid NFA requirements, my dream HD gun would be a pistol caliber carbine with the short barrel, like an Uzi or MP-5. The short barrel for compactness, the caliber for noise consideration (anyone else ever fire a 5.56 indoors? Anyone shoot an NFA barrel 5.56 indoors? You know what I mean), and the stopping power is acceptable - not as good as a rifle or shotgun, but still good enough for the HD application.

Since I can't get my NFA gun without the ridiculous loopholes and cost, I'll stick with my Saiga.
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#75 User is offline   slinkyaroo 

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 03:46 PM

In Canada home defense is a barking dog and a padlock on the beer fridge.
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