Special Ops Paintball: How long is to long?? - Special Ops Paintball

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How long is to long?? At what size does your barrel start to lose power?? Rate Topic: -----

#16 User is offline   Xakk 

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 08:58 PM

... umm... I agree with Damage Incorporated. Consistency is caused by matching paint to bore... having the bore to big and the ball bounces down the barrel causing less consistent shots.

Bore to small and the shell of the paint is squeezed out thus losing what little round shape the paintball had causing breaks, friction and strange flight.

By matching the bore to the paint you create a seal which causes the ball to come out more uniform.

I know my ion with a progressive barrel(16in) gets great consistency(precision)and the paint to bore match is great(with my field's paint) in comparison to my other barrel which was to big. Then again, I dont chop paint if that is what you are referring to by consistency. With a rotor, eyes, and a good paint/bore match, i rarely, if ever, have a gun malfunction or paint break anywhere within the gun or barrel.... :ninja:
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#17 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 07:03 AM

View PostXakk, on Nov 18 2009, 09:58 PM, said:

... umm... I agree with Damage Incorporated. Consistency is caused by matching paint to bore... having the bore to big and the ball bounces down the barrel causing less consistent shots.


That's only one of many factors in consistency though.

As an example, take a Tippmann with a perfect paint/barrel match. Then take an SP1 or Vibe (to be fair, we're using something of comparable price range) and have it slightly overbored.

The SP1/Vibe will still be more consistent over the chrony and will perform better. The reason has to do with the internal design of the marker and the regulator it has.

When we talk about overboring, we're not talking about shooting .679 paint in a .695 barrel or something ridiculous. I'm talking about .689-.69 paint through a .692-.693 barrel.

The smallest barrel I use on any routine basis is .690, and I don't seem to have a problem, and the shooting is pretty consistent with any reasonable paint.

This post has been edited by Thalion: 19 November 2009 - 07:05 AM

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#18 User is offline   Xakk 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 08:13 AM

where did markers come in? we were talking barrels... lol I agree though, tippmann vs smartparts... the sp is always going to shoot more consistent due to internals, but would I over bore... probably not unless it was the best match.
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#19 User is offline   FIFTY CAL 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 08:32 AM

View PostXakk, on Nov 19 2009, 09:13 AM, said:

where did markers come in? we were talking barrels... lol I agree though, tippmann vs smartparts... the sp is always going to shoot more consistent due to internals, but would I over bore... probably not unless it was the best match.


I think he was just saying Tippmanns aren't that consistant. So he used SP-1 as something to compare it too.
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#20 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 08:47 AM

View PostFIFTY CAL, on Nov 19 2009, 09:32 AM, said:

View PostXakk, on Nov 19 2009, 09:13 AM, said:

where did markers come in? we were talking barrels... lol I agree though, tippmann vs smartparts... the sp is always going to shoot more consistent due to internals, but would I over bore... probably not unless it was the best match.


I think he was just saying Tippmanns aren't that consistant. So he used SP-1 as something to compare it too.


Pretty close to it.

What I'm getting at is that consistency isn't just a matter of the barrel/paint match. Consistency of the marker makes a huge difference, and an inconsistent marker with the best paint/barrel "match" still won't compare to a marker with better consistency.
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#21 User is offline   FIFTY CAL 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 08:52 AM

View PostThalion, on Nov 19 2009, 09:47 AM, said:

View PostFIFTY CAL, on Nov 19 2009, 09:32 AM, said:

View PostXakk, on Nov 19 2009, 09:13 AM, said:

where did markers come in? we were talking barrels... lol I agree though, tippmann vs smartparts... the sp is always going to shoot more consistent due to internals, but would I over bore... probably not unless it was the best match.


I think he was just saying Tippmanns aren't that consistant. So he used SP-1 as something to compare it too.


Pretty close to it.

What I'm getting at is that consistency isn't just a matter of the barrel/paint match. Consistency of the marker makes a huge difference, and an inconsistent marker with the best paint/barrel "match" still won't compare to a marker with better consistency.


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#22 User is offline   Damage Incorporated 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 08:58 AM

View PostThalion, on Nov 19 2009, 10:47 AM, said:

What I'm getting at is that consistency isn't just a matter of the barrel/paint match. Consistency of the marker makes a huge difference, and an inconsistent marker with the best paint/barrel "match" still won't compare to a marker with better consistency.



You are right about a higher end marker being more consistent and improving accuracy as well.

Even though it is not a high end marker, I bet my Phantom Duckslide (6 inch barrel) with Freak Inserts is more accurate then a Tippman with a 20 inch barrel.


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#23 User is offline   FIFTY CAL 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 09:01 AM

View PostDamage Incorporated, on Nov 19 2009, 09:58 AM, said:

View PostThalion, on Nov 19 2009, 10:47 AM, said:

What I'm getting at is that consistency isn't just a matter of the barrel/paint match. Consistency of the marker makes a huge difference, and an inconsistent marker with the best paint/barrel "match" still won't compare to a marker with better consistency.



You are right about a higher end marker being more consistent and improving accuracy as well.

Even though it is not a high end marker, I bet my Phantom Duckslide (6 inch barrel) with Freak Inserts is more accurate then a Tippman with a 20 inch barrel.


Probably, I will probably never own a Tippy because of it. And the fact that they sound like a Civil War cannon. :P
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#24 User is offline   Flippy the Wonder Bunny 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 11:02 AM

View PostXakk, on Nov 18 2009, 09:58 PM, said:

... umm... I agree with Damage Incorporated. Consistency is caused by matching paint to bore... having the bore to big and the ball bounces down the barrel causing less consistent shots.

Bore to small and the shell of the paint is squeezed out thus losing what little round shape the paintball had causing breaks, friction and strange flight.

By matching the bore to the paint you create a seal which causes the ball to come out more uniform.

I know my ion with a progressive barrel(16in) gets great consistency(precision)and the paint to bore match is great(with my field's paint) in comparison to my other barrel which was to big. Then again, I dont chop paint if that is what you are referring to by consistency. With a rotor, eyes, and a good paint/bore match, i rarely, if ever, have a gun malfunction or paint break anywhere within the gun or barrel.... :laugh:

Consistency has a whole lot more to do with the reg than with the barrel.
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#25 User is offline   Piller 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 01:20 PM

I would say that length in general (excluding extremely short barrels) doesn't have much rule over accuracy. I don't even worry about paint-barrel match that much. Seriously, I don't think most people will notice a huge difference if their paint is a couple sizes smaller than the barrel. I can understand shooting tiny paint through a large bore is going to become noticeable, anything less than .005 to me is just nit-picking. It's not that bad of a thing if your paint rolls down the barrel. Getting 5+ back pieces is just overkill to me.

Take an old school, 1980s PGP for example. They have a huge bore, short ~6'' barrel, yet they can shoot just about as well as the next high end electro. Granted not anywhere near as fast, but my point is that the overall length of the barrel is not greatly significant except for efficiency. Airgun designs did a test on their markers and found 8-10 inches of unported length to be the most efficient. Now a few more inches of porting isn't goint to hurt much, but in my opinion the only reason for anything longer is comfort. Some like the feel of a longer barrel, whether it be to prop up against bunkers, or to poke through bushes. Ultimately what matters is comfort, and good performance can be found at any reasonable length. I wouldn't buy a barrel looking for the "best" length, or fall into the belief that longer is better.
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#26 User is offline   Xakk 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 01:31 PM

Im differently not saying that barrels are the end all to consistency lol But the OP wanted to know about barrels, so I told him what would give the best results - barrel wise. I agree that my Ion could out shoot any tippmann precision wise, no matter what barrel I used. But if we are honing in on precision, I know that my 16in barrel(with a better p/b match) shoots ropes, while my 12(that's too big of a bore) is not nearly as precise. I can get away with snap shooting on my 16 WAY better than I could on my 12, and its not because of length, but the bore matching up better.

But compared to a tippy, I could probably get away with no barrel jkjk lol :dodgy:

This post has been edited by Xakk: 19 November 2009 - 01:34 PM

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#27 User is offline   FIFTY CAL 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 01:39 PM

View PostXakk, on Nov 19 2009, 02:31 PM, said:

But compared to a tippy, I could probably get away with no barrel jkjk lol :dodgy:


I've always wanted to try that lol
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#28 User is offline   I.K.E. 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 01:40 PM

For as long as I've been reading these forums, everyone has said all this same stuff. So, without the intent to flame, how do you KNOW all of this stuff?

With the exception of the AGD test quoted by Piller, all of the claims in this thread (and the dozens of other similar threads) are entirely unsupported.

Now, I'm not asking for a bibliography, but with as many viewpoints as there have been expressed, I am simply curious as to how the conclusions have been reached. Some people have made very strong assertions, but without any support, it is difficult to evaluate the claim.

I am just curious about how people have decided on all the "science" and what methodology was used to reach these conclusions.

PLEASE NOTE: I am not attempting to flame nor troll. I ask the above purely from curiosity. I have not disputed any claims, nor called anyone out. Just would like to know some sources.

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This post has been edited by I.K.E.: 19 November 2009 - 01:41 PM

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#29 User is offline   Xakk 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 01:59 PM

I tested both of my barrels in a chrono... the 16 was noticeably better than my 12, it had a better p/b match.
As for shooting better than a tippmann, Everyone and their brother has a tippmann out at my local field, we used to always compare precision. Obviously, these test lack a control, yet, the results tend to lean a certain direction, thus, Im answering what I know. :dodgy: hope that's good enough for ya
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#30 User is offline   Damage Incorporated 

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 03:48 PM

Nothing wrong with a Tippman. I started off with an A-5. Actually had two of them.


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