Special Ops Paintball: .50 Caliber - Special Ops Paintball

Jump to content


  • (11 Pages)
  • +
  • « First
  • 5
  • 6
  • 7
  • 8
  • 9
  • Last »
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

.50 Caliber The new standard?

#91 User is offline   Piller 

  • Piller
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 3,363
  • Joined: 23-May 07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Within range
  • Brigade Name:Piller

Posted 12 October 2009 - 08:43 AM

It would all have to do with the amount of force each projectile hits with. .68 caliber paint was restricted to 300 fps mainly for the reason that higher velocities have the potential to break small bones in a person's hand. It's also the speed at which a paintball can pierce a piece of drywall. At 400fps i've heard it can go straight through without leaving a mark.

.50 caliber paint would only be able to shoot at a higher velocity if it the mass was kept lower than a .68 paintball. .50 paint has a smaller area of impact which increases the amount of force it strikes with. If one was to increase the mass of .50 paint to something similar of .68 paint, it's velocity would have to go down accordingly, well below 300fps
Automaggot #123 - Pump User #152 - ICE Epic Owner
"Marketing hype in paintball?! The nerve of some people. After all, we paintballers would never throw our hard earned cash into the magic box of marketing hype."
0

#92 User is offline   Tim Burton 

  • Forum Member
  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 192
  • Joined: 01-July 08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Phoenix, AZ - USA

Posted 12 October 2009 - 06:07 PM

View PostLoneWolf99, on Oct 12 2009, 02:47 AM, said:

We'll see how the insurance companies react to trying to raise the FPS limit - since 300 & below has been the standard for about the last 20 years, it will be easy for them to stick to what they know - so don't expect this to just happen. .68 & .50 at 280 or 290 FPS, the .68 will win every time.


I agree, but from what I understand while the 50 caliber is being kept at 280fps, it is being looked at by insurance companies to raise the fps. Even if you raise the fps to where it hits just a bit lighter than a.68 at 300fps, insurance companies should be happy, and there won't be an issue with goggles.

I won't convert until the moment they raise the fps to at least 400fps. Otherwise, there is no benefit to 50 caliber.
0

#93 User is offline   Flippy the Wonder Bunny 

  • My E-MAN PART is bigger than yours
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 2,984
  • Joined: 04-December 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Abilene, KS

Posted 12 October 2009 - 06:47 PM

View PostTim Burton, on Oct 12 2009, 08:07 PM, said:

I won't convert until the moment they raise the fps to at least 400fps. Otherwise, there is no benefit to 50 caliber.

Any science behind that or are you just pulling out assumptions like most people in this thread?
0

#94 User is offline   Tim Burton 

  • Forum Member
  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 192
  • Joined: 01-July 08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Phoenix, AZ - USA

Posted 12 October 2009 - 11:49 PM

View PostFlippy the Wonder Bunny, on Oct 12 2009, 06:47 PM, said:

View PostTim Burton, on Oct 12 2009, 08:07 PM, said:

I won't convert until the moment they raise the fps to at least 400fps. Otherwise, there is no benefit to 50 caliber.

Any science behind that or are you just pulling out assumptions like most people in this thread?



Actually, I do have data. So far, I'm one of the few people who aren't talking out his butt about the rounds.

An engineer did the calculations in the links below. While, I'm not great at mathematical physics (I just know conceptually the theories due to a funky MTE 482 class), the calcs look to be accurate.

http://www.x7og.net/general-paintball-rela...html#post315113

So it seems that the shots are better at 440-480fps and have the same kinetic energy. Safety shouldn't be an issue. Making a round that will break at long distances, yet still be sturdy enough to take that type of acceleration is. Can the rounds do that? I don't see why not, but until there is more hands on, we won't know.

Is this increase in fps enough to justify a 50 caliber round. I believe so. Even if it doesn't go mainstream for 3 or 4 years, this will allow for snipers who are shooting cheaper paint. A middle ground between FS and .68 "snipers".

The link above provides a great read. I recommend it.
0

#95 User is offline   Epic win 

  • Sophomore Member
  • PipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 342
  • Joined: 14-May 08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Yellow Submarine
  • Brigade Name:Yardsalesniper312

Posted 14 October 2009 - 07:00 PM

Is it true that planet eclipse is going to make .50 cal. conversion kits for the egos?

This post has been edited by Epic win: 14 October 2009 - 07:00 PM

0

#96 User is offline   d4rkmonkey 

  • that funky monkey...
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 1,577
  • Joined: 24-February 08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Toronto, ON

Posted 14 October 2009 - 08:17 PM

They already did...
Posted Image
Flickr
Bitches and guns, this is every man's dream. I don't want to go home, where I'm just an ordinary human being...
0

#97 User is offline   LoneWolf99 

  • Sophomore Member
  • PipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 433
  • Joined: 27-February 06

Posted 17 October 2009 - 07:02 AM

Remember, once you get to those higher velocities (and just try to manage a mix of .68 & .50 players shooting different FPS on the same field) you start getting some wicked vortecies & screwing up the flight characteristics of the paint.

Also, if you read the ASTM standards, it is 300 FPS, regardless of caliber of paint.
0

#98 User is offline   Minnesota Sn1p3r 

  • Back on the Attack!
  • PipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 361
  • Joined: 26-September 08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Market, MN
  • Brigade Name:MN Sn1p3r

Posted 21 October 2009 - 11:45 AM

I think that .50 cal paint is an interesting idea, but it just isn't realistic...

Sure, you get more bang for your buck, but thats LATER! The companies that switch will have to buy new machines and they will pay for that by raising the retail price of paintballs. New markers, I would love to hear someone express how happy they would be buying a new marker to switch paint sizes! Its just a little thing that people were thinking about and a few companys will apply it and find that there are no benefits that come from it. Paintballs are .68 cal, they work just fine! There are no benefits that players will recieve by switching to the smaller paint size.

I have heard this on other forums and everyone is so happy because you will get more paint and for cheaper, but not until at least 5 - 10 years after the switch will the price of paint even begin to lower.

.50 cal paint is an interesting idea, but it just isn't practical...
"Its better to out-think your enemy than to out-fight them" - Sun Tzu

"I dont like paying for the same realestate twice" - General George S. Patton
0

#99 User is online   The Stuntman 

  • I feel like I'm taking Crazy Pills!
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Administrators
  • Posts: 2,720
  • Joined: 06-September 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Santa Cruz CA
  • Brigade Name:The Stuntman

Posted 21 October 2009 - 11:55 AM

Ive done some checking around & NONE of the fields in my area plan on stocking .50 cal paint. Since some of these places are Field Paint Only, that pretty much means that .50 will not be allowed.
0

#100 User is offline   CapnStank 

  • Sophomore Member
  • PipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 606
  • Joined: 04-September 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Regina Saskatchewan
  • Brigade Name:CapnStank

Posted 21 October 2009 - 11:56 AM

View PostMinnesota Sn1p3r, on Oct 21 2009, 12:45 PM, said:

I have heard this on other forums and everyone is so happy because you will get more paint and for cheaper, but not until at least 5 - 10 years after the switch will the price of paint even begin to lower.

.50 cal paint is an interesting idea, but it just isn't practical...


Not a flame but when would you like to see the transition in the sport if its going to take 5-10 years? I'm more than happy to let it hit now and watch to see where it goes rather than 10 years later.

The majority of serious pball players (like many of us here) will be purchasing a new marker within 5 years. If fields begin to stock 50cal for those few people then the transition is painless and will allow for people to play both styles.
"Watch out for the guy with the pump, they tend to hit their target."
My BST Feedback: +3/0
0

#101 User is offline   CapnStank 

  • Sophomore Member
  • PipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 606
  • Joined: 04-September 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Regina Saskatchewan
  • Brigade Name:CapnStank

Posted 21 October 2009 - 11:59 AM

View PostThe Stuntman, on Oct 21 2009, 12:55 PM, said:

Ive done some checking around & NONE of the fields in my area plan on stocking .50 cal paint. Since some of these places are Field Paint Only, that pretty much means that .50 will not be allowed.


My field hadn't even heard of it yet.

You could come to an agreement with the staff though. They don't want off-field paint because it competes with their prices. If you want to use something they aren't offering then why should they argue? Offer them $20 extra to pay. They'd be dumb to refuse your money if they aren't willing to offer an alternative.

Good business will realize that to keep faithful customers they have to adjust business models to changing trends. Those who resist will falter *cough* media corporations against digital content *cough*.
"Watch out for the guy with the pump, they tend to hit their target."
My BST Feedback: +3/0
0

#102 User is offline   Minnesota Sn1p3r 

  • Back on the Attack!
  • PipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 361
  • Joined: 26-September 08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Market, MN
  • Brigade Name:MN Sn1p3r

Posted 21 October 2009 - 12:02 PM

View PostCapnStank, on Oct 21 2009, 11:56 AM, said:

View PostMinnesota Sn1p3r, on Oct 21 2009, 12:45 PM, said:

I have heard this on other forums and everyone is so happy because you will get more paint and for cheaper, but not until at least 5 - 10 years after the switch will the price of paint even begin to lower.

.50 cal paint is an interesting idea, but it just isn't practical...


Not a flame but when would you like to see the transition in the sport if its going to take 5-10 years? I'm more than happy to let it hit now and watch to see where it goes rather than 10 years later.

The majority of serious pball players (like many of us here) will be purchasing a new marker within 5 years. If fields begin to stock 50cal for those few people then the transition is painless and will allow for people to play both styles.

Totally understandable but, Im not saying the transition will take 5 to 10, im saying that the price on .50 paint will be really high so the maufacturer of the paint can pay for the switch. Id say that a transition to .50 cal paint would take only 1 to 2 years.

I am totally open to the switch, but i would like to be able to keep the marker that I have for a few more years, if they switch all markers and paint to .50, you can bet that i will switch!
"Its better to out-think your enemy than to out-fight them" - Sun Tzu

"I dont like paying for the same realestate twice" - General George S. Patton
0

#103 User is online   The Stuntman 

  • I feel like I'm taking Crazy Pills!
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Administrators
  • Posts: 2,720
  • Joined: 06-September 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Santa Cruz CA
  • Brigade Name:The Stuntman

Posted 21 October 2009 - 01:33 PM

A sensible article on .50 cal ...from Paintball X3 Business Journal:

http://www.paintballx3.com/latest/industry...er-coming.html#

I like the contrast betwee GI Milsim assuring us that the whole industry will "obviously"
swich to .50 cal:

Quote

Does GI Milsim expect there to be an industry-wide changeover to the new paintball size? Their answer we received was, “Eventually, yes. .50 caliber is an obvious next step to improve the game for players.

versus what the people in the industry actually say themselves:

Quote

Eric Bratten of Tiberius Arms said, “Personally I don't see it being ‘an industry wide changeover’ "

Quote

John Higgins of Hater Paintball told us, “I do not [see that happening]. The inventory and re-tooling costs are too high.

Quote

Tom Ghee added, “Alternates to .68 caliber paintballs have been tried several times before. The idea and all the rationale behind it sounds good. However, unless velocities are substantially reduced, the physics of playing makes it less desirable. The retooling for manufacturers is another substantial obstacle to acceptance....I think the likelihood of substantial acceptance is unlikely.”

0

#104 User is offline   Ethrealwolf 

  • If we must die, we will die. but we will never yield.
  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 938
  • Joined: 13-April 07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Fayetteville, NC
  • Brigade Name:HALOWOLF

Posted 21 October 2009 - 01:42 PM

With the information compiled so far? .50 has value as a niche and overseas market paint, but not mainstream.

Current Ballistics testing shows it to be broadly inferior to .68- lost range, greater vulnerability to wind and drift, Bleeds energy too quickly to be effective out to even 100 ft @300 FPS (with italia himself saying there's no plan to seek an increase in velocity for .50), and it's Breakability apparently leaves much to be desired, leaving it's main strengths cost (offset by poor performance, meaning you'll have to shoot more paint to acheive the same thing) and Efficiency.

In terms of overseas, though, Because .50 has less mass (significantly so) and it dosen't retain energy that well, it *could* be used to get paintball into places where markers are classified as firearms (like japan, as an example) because of joule limits on projectiles.

In not so many words, as a mainstream projectile? Hell no. for new players and overseas with strict gun control laws? hell yes.
We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
We ran to the sounds of the thunder.
We danced among the lightning bolts,
and tore the world asunder.

http://onpaintball.blogspot.com/
0

#105 User is offline   TaCticulMerderer18 

  • Tom Kaye, Mike Cassidy, Glenn Palmer and Budd Orr.... DemiGods
  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 963
  • Joined: 23-April 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:NH
  • Brigade Name:Shiek

Posted 21 October 2009 - 03:39 PM

View PosttheDrone, on Jul 25 2009, 04:06 PM, said:

Seems this topic has gone a bit off topic and become a bit of a hate on SP thread.
Yea some people hate SP for something that was done, but it's done and over.
You can go on hating them for the rest of your life, but whining over and over and
over is fairly ridiculous. it changes nothing. Love or Hate.... SP is around and doing
their thing so how about just talking about their current ideas and leave it at that.



I have seen comments like this throughout the whole .50 cal BS. The uneducated players are voicing their ill contempt for the hate being spewed at the very mention of Smart Parts. They say to stop hating over something that has happened in the past. Well, this is happening NOW. It doesnt seem like peope have come to realize it yet here, but this new company AKA GImilsim, has emerged from SP's soon to be ashes. Headed by "those that have been there since the biginning" (pfft yea okay), they are getting out while the gettings good, is all. Getting out of SP before their accumulated debt drowns them.

Once again they are attempting to corner the industry in order to make a buck. (previously patenting property that wasnt their own, forcing manufacturers to pay royalties or even close their doors. hence the hate directed toward SP)

honestly i see no pro to switching to .50 cal. there is no technilogical advancement, in fact its actually moving back a step for the industry. for you guys interested in this change, you have fun shelling out the cash to conform to the latest hype, as for us more educated who are unwilling to change what is not broken, look here... make yourself known that there are still players who will not stand by and Smart Par... er... GImilsim (tomato tomaato), try to ruin the sport.

Even if you don't see it on the site, we can still get it for you!!!
No, we won't be stocking .50 caliber anything....
0

Share this topic:


  • (11 Pages)
  • +
  • « First
  • 5
  • 6
  • 7
  • 8
  • 9
  • Last »
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

1 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users