Special Ops Paintball: Spyder Fasta Clarification - Special Ops Paintball

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Spyder Fasta Clarification Rate Topic: -----

#16 User is offline   motoguy1251 

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 02:35 PM

Your talking 9v right. CUz i believe the 18 will do closer to 20-25 ish. Or it seems to on my e gripped tippy.
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#17 User is offline   Chaos 

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 02:45 PM

An agitated hopper ultimately still relies on gravity to feed the balls. Theoretically this limits it to about 13.3bps. If you can add a second 9V battery to this hopper and it can feed at more than twice that, there is obviously more than gravity at work, hence making the Fasta a force fed hopper.
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#18 User is offline   Danger Dan 

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 03:37 PM

The Fasta is an agitating hopper because it does not FORCE the balls DOWN the feedneck. The difference is that in the Fasta and other like hoppers there is not a gide that forces the balls down the feedneck. Just an agitating paddle that stirs the balls up till they find their way down the feedneck.

The reason that the 18 volt Fasta was not legal was that it had a factory rating over the legal limit.

The reason was just that it "agitated" the balls faster.
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#19 Guest_PaleRider_*

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 04:02 PM

WOW!
I need to know what kind of feed system a fasta has and all I get
is a big debate.....1/2 saying it's a force and 1/2 saying it agitating

Guess I will have to find one an look inside myself. :D
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#20 User is offline   Lomarandil 

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 04:20 PM

So, correct me if I'm wrong... Trying to put a definition on these terms

Forcefed: Uses a channel or raceway, where the operation of the hopper places force on the paint while in said raceway/channel.

Agitating: Still may contain a channel or raceway, but the operation of the hopper only places force on the paint before it enters said raceway/channel.

Is that any good?
Lo

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#21 User is offline   Timbertiger 

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 11:37 PM

View PostLomarandil, on Jan 16 2008, 05:20 PM, said:

So, correct me if I'm wrong... Trying to put a definition on these terms

Forcefed: Uses a channel or raceway, where the operation of the hopper places force on the paint while in said raceway/channel.

Agitating: Still may contain a channel or raceway, but the operation of the hopper only places force on the paint before it enters said raceway/channel.

Is that any good?
Lo


Your correct...........also I have an 18 Volt Fasta on the way and we are going to compare it to the 9 volt..................but otherwise Pale Rider...........that's what I'm saying they are identical! From what Krazy says the blades slip over the paint and don't actually cause force downward accept when the hopper is running! If the hopper is not running the blades rest in a position not putting downward pressure on the ball! But if your definition is that it is indeed a forcefed hopper............than you'll have to ban both fasta's in their entirety including the one that is advertised at 15 BPS. I also received confirmation today that the 18 volts do work with only one battery however they are very slow compared to with two battery's...........but obviously it should be half the speed! If you guys want when I get them both side by side I'll take videos!
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#22 User is offline   count scoobith 

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Posted 17 January 2008 - 07:55 AM

When I was told that it was a Force feed I saw it like this.

A revy, TSA halo, ssl-200, richo, etc etc gravtity feeds.... WORK even if they don't have a battery in them because paint can still drop past the fingers.

Halo, Fasta, egg, pulse, etc etc force feeds.... PUSH the balls into a raceway, and WILL NOT feed paint if the batteries are dead.

Simply as that....


Edit:
Just look at the picture... http://www.pbreview.com/productpics/?actio...mp;product=4991
You can see that it forces / pushes the paint down the race way, into the chamber. Which in my book mean force feed regardless if it actually is putting pressure on the balls when it's idle LIKE the halo, reloader B, pulse, volicity....

Don't get me wrong here... I would LOVE to be able to use my halo or any other Force feed in the sppl. BUT, that's not the case and force feeds aren't allowed. Then we all need to be on the same page, and I think the fasta eguals force feed.

This post has been edited by count scoobith: 17 January 2008 - 08:03 AM

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#23 User is offline   WrathOfTheGods 

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Posted 17 January 2008 - 08:01 AM

Its too easy to add the other 9v to the 18v fasta's. Yes the refs could always check, but why add another variable to their job, when it is going to be busy for them already. Besides read the rules, or actually let me break it down like this, How fast does the 18v claim to be able to feed per second? over 15? theres your answer.


If there is no force on the paint once they enter the raceway, then its not force fed, Halos and the like reach their feed rates because of the force that is kept on them. My thoughts.

This post has been edited by WrathOfTheGods: 17 January 2008 - 08:05 AM

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#24 User is offline   count scoobith 

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Posted 17 January 2008 - 08:14 AM

LOL... you know what WrathOfTheGods ... you just had me rethink something. :)

Your right....
"If there is no force on the paint once they enter the raceway, then its not force fed, Halos and the like reach their feed rates because of the force that is kept on them. My thoughts. "
Just like the Tippmann Cyclone feeder... right .... ;)
They allow that, so why not a Fasta since it's not putting force on the paint just like the cyclone. The Cyclone can feed faster than 15 for sure, but they're allowed. Since everyone is capped at 15bps anyways, why not allow the fasta 9volt 15 bps version since it's allot like the cyclone on tippies. ;)

In short... I think the fasta is like an Egg... NOT a true force feed, but DOES push the paint down a race way, which equals force feed. The tippman cylcone would fall in that catagory as well.... but that horse has been beaten enough.
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#25 User is offline   Timbertiger 

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Posted 17 January 2008 - 09:23 AM

View Postcount scoobith, on Jan 17 2008, 09:14 AM, said:

LOL... you know what WrathOfTheGods ... you just had me rethink something. :)

Your right....
"If there is no force on the paint once they enter the raceway, then its not force fed, Halos and the like reach their feed rates because of the force that is kept on them. My thoughts. "
Just like the Tippmann Cyclone feeder... right .... :)
They allow that, so why not a Fasta since it's not putting force on the paint just like the cyclone. The Cyclone can feed faster than 15 for sure, but they're allowed. Since everyone is capped at 15bps anyways, why not allow the fasta 9volt 15 bps version since it's allot like the cyclone on tippies. ;)

In short... I think the fasta is like an Egg... NOT a true force feed, but DOES push the paint down a race way, which equals force feed. The tippman cylcone would fall in that catagory as well.... but that horse has been beaten enough.


So are the Tippmann hoppers similar?...........never actually looked at one up close..........but since they are all made by the same company..........I would think it would be very similar except without the 18 volt version.
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#26 User is offline   Timbertiger 

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Posted 17 January 2008 - 09:36 AM

View Postadrenalineguy, on Jan 16 2008, 03:29 PM, said:

I had to look into the fasta thing closer. Wolfe is a good guy and I hate to be on a different side of the fence then he is him....

Enis Ruston ( sorry about the spelling) owner of Rickochet and designer of the fasta said " yes it's force fed" , "it has never reached over 15 pbs in any testing"

many so called "aggitated" hoppers have the paddles forceing the balls down the hole. if the paddles continously go around one way it puts pressure on the ball.

He recomended a thrird party drop test. fill one with 200 balls and run them out with a fresh battery. it can only get slower


Drop tests always run much higher than on gun tests............easiest way is throw it on a marker capable of 30 BPS and find out how fast it will shoot uncapped. Will do on Sat.
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#27 User is offline   count scoobith 

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Posted 17 January 2008 - 11:45 AM

View PostTimbertiger, on Jan 17 2008, 09:23 AM, said:

So are the Tippmann hoppers similar?...........never actually looked at one up close..........but since they are all made by the same company..........I would think it would be very similar except without the 18 volt version.


Yes they are differant.
The ssl-200 has a tray, BUT the paddels push the balls over the hole much like the revy, which makes it more of a gravity feed. The Ricochet and triumph are pretty much the same with just a differant out shell.

Fast profile:
http://www.pbreview.com/productpics/?actio...mp;product=4991

SSL-200 profile:
http://www.pbreview.com/productpics/?produ...amp;photo=10176

They both work pretty much the same. It's just that the fasta pushes balls into the raceway and chamber. The ssl-200 pushes the balls over and towards the feedneck. Much like the revy.


EDIT:
OK this is my last post on this... I'll check here and there to see what jayson decides. ;)
For the record, I actually enjoy using my vortex revy over my halo. I found that it made me THINK more about making other around me better rather than worry about how much paint I can through out there.
I only want this issue to be resolved and a ruling made so we can all move on and play some ball. :laugh:

Take care guys, I hope to see you on the field somewhere... :laugh:

This post has been edited by count scoobith: 17 January 2008 - 11:51 AM

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#28 User is offline   Lomarandil 

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Posted 17 January 2008 - 11:54 AM

View PostTimbertiger, on Jan 17 2008, 09:36 AM, said:

View Postadrenalineguy, on Jan 16 2008, 03:29 PM, said:

I had to look into the fasta thing closer. Wolfe is a good guy and I hate to be on a different side of the fence then he is him....

Enis Ruston ( sorry about the spelling) owner of Rickochet and designer of the fasta said " yes it's force fed" , "it has never reached over 15 pbs in any testing"

many so called "aggitated" hoppers have the paddles forceing the balls down the hole. if the paddles continously go around one way it puts pressure on the ball.

He recomended a thrird party drop test. fill one with 200 balls and run them out with a fresh battery. it can only get slower


Drop tests always run much higher than on gun tests............easiest way is throw it on a marker capable of 30 BPS and find out how fast it will shoot uncapped. Will do on Sat.



True, but the way the rules are worded, they call for hoppers rated under 15bps. A hopper's rating in the paintball world is based on drop testing (which is why hoppers rated at 14bps might only provide 11-12 regularly).. So This call has to be based off the pure drop test, if we are going to second-guess the manufacturer rating.

From what I've seen of the Fasta, if the paddles extend downward into the raceway, then it is a forcefeed. If the single row of paintballs sitting in the raceway are untouched by the paddles while the motor is running, that's agitated. I can't be sure which the situation is, from the limited pictures.

Lo

This post has been edited by Lomarandil: 17 January 2008 - 11:55 AM


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#29 Guest_PaleRider_*

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Posted 17 January 2008 - 01:27 PM

Thank you for all your input and comments.

Here is the official word on the FASTA hoppers

The 9V fasta is legal to use in the SPPL.

The 18V Fasta is not legal. It doesn’t matter if it has one battery or two.



It is time to move on reguarding the subject of hoppers. The rules are up and clear.

As requested this thread is closed.
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