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Sociology. We are the Youth of the Nation. Rate Topic: ***** 1 Votes

#1 Guest_SaltandVinegar_*

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 03:07 PM

We've been discussing a lot in Sociology, you've probably notice me mention that class quite a bit lately. Well, the past few days we've been studying school shootings and the causes. It's incredibly disturbing how preventable these events are. For one, it's hate and little "jokes" that cause the demons insides shooters. The next thing we saw was that, every single school shooter did something to reach out. They filmed their last wills and testaments, they filmed many videos of themselves. They posted websites and warned of what would happen. So far I am incredibly disturbed at the growing number of school shootings. One answer is to remove guns, my opinion differs. It's an idea, but we can't completely rid guns. But what we need to do is look at the warning signs of what is about to happen. That would help stop anything about to occur.

Anybody else study something similar, or have anything to discuss on this topic?
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#2 User is offline   Florentine 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 03:11 PM

well i have a friend that is having problems at school and he tells me that hes gonna do a school shooting. i talk to him once he tells me that and it changes his mind until school again. its an ongoing process. i cant tell anybody cause that would make me look bad on my part and it works when i tell him not to do it
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#3 User is offline   foozeball67 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 03:35 PM

well the only problem with reporting the warnings some teens give prior to shootings is that you don't know if they're really going to follow through on their actions or if they're just talking a big game.

but their warnings, sincere or not, should be taken VERY seriously.
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#4 User is offline   Ashrak 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 03:47 PM

View PostSaltandVinegar, on Mar 20 2008, 06:07 PM, said:

We've been discussing a lot in Sociology, you've probably notice me mention that class quite a bit lately. Well, the past few days we've been studying school shootings and the causes. It's incredibly disturbing how preventable these events are. For one, it's hate and little "jokes" that cause the demons insides shooters. The next thing we saw was that, every single school shooter did something to reach out. They filmed their last wills and testaments, they filmed many videos of themselves. They posted websites and warned of what would happen. So far I am incredibly disturbed at the growing number of school shootings. One answer is to remove guns, my opinion differs. It's an idea, but we can't completely rid guns. But what we need to do is look at the warning signs of what is about to happen. That would help stop anything about to occur.

Anybody else study something similar, or have anything to discuss on this topic?


This is my message to all those who want to shoot up a school:

Someone made fun of you? Suck it up.

Someone put you in a locker? Suck it up.

Your life, no matter how sad you think it is, is still better than the slums of Pakistan, New Delhi, Bengledesh, etc. If you want revenge go after the one responsible and not innocent bystanders. By shooting up anyone you see in a hallway, you become evil, and I lose whatever sympathy I had. Please note that this is coming from me who was never a popular kid. I was called the n-word (though I am white, by a black kid) was beat up (a couple times, though by no means seriously), and cussed out. Yet, I never had the inclination to shoot, stab, or otherwise maim anyone.
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#5 User is offline   Fenrisulfr 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 04:12 PM

Ironically enough I just got finished watching "American History X."

Unfortunatly, this was my first time watching it... and I'm 19. I've only known about it for a couple months as well.

I want to add something, but I can't find the words.
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#6 Guest_SaltandVinegar_*

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 05:24 PM

View PostAshrak, on Mar 20 2008, 04:47 PM, said:

This is my message to all those who want to shoot up a school:

Someone made fun of you? Suck it up.

Someone put you in a locker? Suck it up.

Your life, no matter how sad you think it is, is still better than the slums of Pakistan, New Delhi, Bengledesh, etc. If you want revenge go after the one responsible and not innocent bystanders. By shooting up anyone you see in a hallway, you become evil, and I lose whatever sympathy I had. Please note that this is coming from me who was never a popular kid. I was called the n-word (though I am white, by a black kid) was beat up (a couple times, though by no means seriously), and cussed out. Yet, I never had the inclination to shoot, stab, or otherwise maim anyone.


Here's the problem ashrak. If society wasn't so cruel to one another we wouldn't have to worry about sucking it up. Do I agree with you? Yes. But does that mean people are going to suck it up? No. We create them, yet, we have the power to stop it, and prevent it. One video we watched the kids said they all went through the same thing, so why not do it to this kid. Trust me, physical pain is not even close to being as bad as mental pain. A living hell will never be physical, it will always be mental.

Fooze, I see your point, but why risk not reporting it? But, you do show that you should take it serious. Joking or not, there would obviously be some mental cries for help going on there.
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#7 User is offline   Ashrak 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 05:28 PM

I've lived with mental pain, and lived.

There will never be a utopia or even 1/3 of a utopia. People will be called names, bullied, etc. Maybe if schools would let people actually fight back and not punish those who defend themselves, we wouldn't have these "pent up rage" issues. Instead, the victim can't even act to defend him/herself and is even punished for it. These utopians running our public ed contribute to the problem as well. (Not that they will tell you that, of course.)
Alea iacta est ~ The board is set, the pieces are moving.
~ Like the leaves of the forest when Summer is green, That host with their banners at sunset were seen:
Like the leaves of the forest when Autumn hath blown, That host on the morrow lay withered and strown. ~ Destruction of Sennacherib

~ Believe me, dear Sir: there is not in the American states a man who more cordially loves a union with his country than I do. But, by the God that made me, I will cease to exist before I yield to a connection on such terms as the United States Congress proposes; and in this, I think I speak the sentiments of America. ~ Thomas Jefferson (modernized)
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#8 Guest_SaltandVinegar_*

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 05:33 PM

View PostAshrak, on Mar 20 2008, 06:28 PM, said:

I've lived with mental pain, and lived. Mental illness? Have you ever had parents at home believing you could do nothing, kids at school messing with your head, and your grades dropping from the sum of all of this? Have you felt you had nothing else to lose? Until you feel what it really means to have mental pain, you won't go through and say suck it up. You will understand. You would rather see them pull through it than suffer through it. Unfortunently, some of them choose to pull through it the wrong way and don't get the assistance they need.

There will never be a utopia or even 1/3 of a utopia. People will be called names, bullied, etc. Maybe if schools would let people actually fight back and not punish those who defend themselves, we wouldn't have these "pent up rage" issues. Instead, the victim can't even act to defend him/herself and is even punished for it. These utopians running our public ed contribute to the problem as well. (Not that they will tell you that, of course.)


So, you're only solution to the problem is to tell them to suck it up? Umm, no.
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#9 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 05:49 PM

Here's what needs to be done, EVERYTHING needs to be looked at. The system, the man, and the society we live in. People are expected to be superhuman with having to get involved in everything they can to get ahead. Colleges are getting harder and harder to get in because of money AND standards. More people have to compete for scholarships because of it and that leads to another load. There is unseen stress from simply expectations, and indirectly from the things that are caused by them.

Some people would like to tell people to punch a bag, take off a load, or suck it up because in their day they had to walk through 15ft of snow up hill both ways, thats not the kind of stress that is causing the problems now. These people lived in a different time, despite relativity, so it is not possible for them to comprehend what I'm talking about so I excuse their ignorance because there is nothing they can do about it.

Everything needs to be looked at and made more lax. EVERYONE needs to chill out and take a look at individuals. There are all kinds of reform that needs to be made for this kind of stuff to happen in the time we live in. Colleges should interview students based on their character more than test scores IF they are going to be more competitive. They could just sacrifice their money and not be so hard on standards, but thats no realistic since everyone is greedy. Schools need to give the rights the students already have to them instead of abusing their authority to keep those rights from students. Parents need to quit relying on censorship and activities outside their home to parent their kids and do their damn job. People themselves need to quit caring so much. I could go on forever but I think i hit the main points.
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#10 User is offline   Sascwatch 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 05:58 PM

It is very similar to suicide. People need to reach out more. Society has become all huddled together in groups and people get left out for one reason or another. All these computers and tvs and things just further separate people. Imaginations run wild, bad movies play in heads, media covers mostly bad stuff like this so people are exposed to it more and more and feel like it gets them attention. A reason could be made for anything though. It might have a lot to do with their parents and childhood too.
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#11 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 06:07 PM

View PostSascwatch, on Mar 20 2008, 05:58 PM, said:

It is very similar to suicide. People need to reach out more. Society has become all huddled together in groups and people get left out for one reason or another. All these computers and tvs and things just further separate people. Imaginations run wild, bad movies play in heads, media covers mostly bad stuff like this so people are exposed to it more and more and feel like it gets them attention. A reason could be made for anything though. It might have a lot to do with their parents and childhood too.

Gah i agree with your train of thought but I cant agree with the media thing. The internet has been popular and a social thing so to me it would actually help some people, despite a new medium of harassment. Its easier for people to talk to a computer knowing the inanimate display pic sending text in return for text originates halfway across the country and the only thing you have to do if you start to feel uncomfortable with the text you are receiving is hit an ignore button of some kind. You can't do that in HS. Media only effects those who let it, and young minds are shaped by their environments so the problem ultimately gets traced back to their parents. I'm not against accountability, but if students, even of age, are denied rights then one can only assume that they are not mature enough to be held responsible otherwise they would have rights to accompany that maturity. Therefore, parents are ultimately responsible.

This post has been edited by ghostinthewood: 20 March 2008 - 06:08 PM

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#12 User is offline   Sascwatch 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 06:24 PM

I was bouncing around with my thoughts. I was just saying it doesn't help that every time someone shoots up a school that person gets tons of attention and credit bad or not. Could help give that certain person a reason to go through with it. But I don't really know
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#13 Guest_SaltandVinegar_*

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 07:02 PM

I think the media affects a small minority of people who are the ones who end up doing this and the majority are not affected. Nonetheless, the media should try and find more positive things, even though that is hard to find in this world.
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#14 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 07:05 PM

View PostSaltandVinegar, on Mar 20 2008, 07:02 PM, said:

I think the media affects a small minority of people who are the ones who end up doing this and the majority are not affected. Nonetheless, the media should try and find more positive things, even though that is hard to find in this world.

Realistically though, that wont happen since it doesnt get ratings. There are quips about people sending soldiers support mail but whole sections on a single soldier throwing a puppy. That means a new direction has to be taken to prevent bad things from happening, and good parenting is very realistic. Of course there will be psychotics and the like, but this is all stress-induced. However, the effects are more severe than asthma.

Better media is somthing to think about, but impossible to consider.

This post has been edited by ghostinthewood: 20 March 2008 - 07:06 PM

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#15 Guest_SaltandVinegar_*

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 07:10 PM

View Postghostinthewood, on Mar 20 2008, 08:05 PM, said:

View PostSaltandVinegar, on Mar 20 2008, 07:02 PM, said:

I think the media affects a small minority of people who are the ones who end up doing this and the majority are not affected. Nonetheless, the media should try and find more positive things, even though that is hard to find in this world.

Realistically though, that wont happen since it doesnt get ratings. There are quips about people sending soldiers support mail but whole sections on a single soldier throwing a puppy. That means a new direction has to be taken to prevent bad things from happening, and good parenting is very realistic. Of course there will be psychotics and the like, but this is all stress-induced. However, the effects are more severe than asthma.

Better media is somthing to think about, but impossible to consider.


Plus, I'm not sure how effective more positive media would be to the American psychology. Yes it is all stress induced. I haven't learned about the different types of murder yet, but I have learned about the different types of suicide. Media just wouldn't cause suicide, so Ghost, you are mostly correct. I haven't taken psychology yet, so I don't know how much more it would affect the human mind.
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