Special Ops Paintball: AR Build - Special Ops Paintball

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AR Build

#76 User is offline   PistolWhipped 

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 04:51 PM

For pure HD I personally like a good 12 gauge (or 20 gauge for the recoil sensitive) because it blows a hole like nothing else can. And at HD ranges, it would handle like any other firearm. You don't need to really account for spread in a house and when it connects on the other end, it's creating between 8 and 24 separate wound channels (assuming anything from 00/000 buck to #4 buck). No other civilian legal weapon can do that much damage that fast at range.

As far as ranges involved, 100 yards is quite doable with magnum slugs and decent sights on a shotgun. Most people forget how far that is. 50 yards is pretty easy with a handgun. I've hit a rabid raccoon at that range with a .357 Magnum. Just focus on fundamentals. People can do 100 yards easy enough and with enough practice (and a handgun conducive to it) much farther. I know a gent with a Five-seveN that can hit a deer silhouette target at 200 yards. Part of it is the flat shooting round, part of it is the low recoil, but by and large, the biggest factor is his skill.

Rifles are good tools, but range is somewhat overrated in most instances. My Mosin could probably connect for many hundreds of yards, but if I shot a guy that far out, it'd be all bur impossible to prove that as self-defense. Even if you blew a guys face off at 50 yards, how can you prove he was a clear and imminent threat unless there is a rifle on his body too. And how often are you gonna have a rifle on you at the same time a guy trying to shoot you is?
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#77 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 05:38 PM

Outside of the more left-wing areas, if one has to shoot in home defense, then it doesn't matter what you end up shooting someone with. One could make the argument they usually have the Mosin for deer hunting, but it was the gun most accessible from where they were when it all went south.

Even in Minnesota, the only state to vote against Ronald Reagan's reelection in 1984, it's considered acceptable to use an AR-15 in self defense, just so long as you one can easily see your perspective at the time of shooting. Doesn't even matter if the guy was unarmed, as long as you had reason to think he was at the time.
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#78 User is offline   PistolWhipped 

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 05:48 PM

I meant shooting a guy at 400 yards. If you're justified to use lethal force, then you are justified, and if you aren't you aren't. A 400 yard shot is hard to explain though.

This post has been edited by PistolWhipped: 30 November 2010 - 05:48 PM

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#79 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 09:01 AM

"I swear I saw him carrying mortar rounds."

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#80 User is offline   PistolWhipped 

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 04:33 PM

Stealing that. :D

Back on topic, you leaning an any particular direction with that set-up yet?
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#81 User is offline   ninja monkey 

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 12:48 PM

View Postghostinthewood, on 29 November 2010 - 09:01 AM, said:

That is an amazing video.

Thinking ahead, coupled mags for home defense? Yay nay?


i have 3 rounds loaded in to my mag on my m4 and i have 6 rnds in my 45. hollow point, hollow point, fmj, hollow point, fmj, hollow point

View PostThalion, on 30 November 2010 - 03:31 PM, said:

View PostLoD, on 30 November 2010 - 04:11 PM, said:

Sorry Will, I guess I stand corrected. I was always under the impression that .223 was bad for HD because if you miss it would go through walls... But apparently I'm being told otherwise.. And just for the record, I wasn't telling him at all to get a shotgun over an AR. I was just simply stating I *thought* shotguns were better for HD.. But apparently not.


Shotguns may well be better for HD for some people. Just not because of penetration issues.

My go-to gun in home defense is a shotgun (Saiga 12). For some people, I'd recommend a carbine. For some, a shotgun.

Personally, if I could avoid NFA requirements, my dream HD gun would be a pistol caliber carbine with the short barrel, like an Uzi or MP-5. The short barrel for compactness, the caliber for noise consideration (anyone else ever fire a 5.56 indoors? Anyone shoot an NFA barrel 5.56 indoors? You know what I mean), and the stopping power is acceptable - not as good as a rifle or shotgun, but still good enough for the HD application.

Since I can't get my NFA gun without the ridiculous loopholes and cost, I'll stick with my Saiga.


you should be able to get one in single fire, you should only have to have a class 3 if its full auto.
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#82 User is offline   PistolWhipped 

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 01:12 PM

Incorrect. It also qualities as a Class 3 if it has a stock AND the barrel is rifled and under 16" (A Short Barreled Rifle). Or for a smoothbore shotgun, a barrel under the 18" (a Short Barreled Shotgun with a full stock, or Any Other Weapon with a pistol grip).
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#83 User is offline   ninja monkey 

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 08:08 PM

maybe where your at, my buddy has a shot gun with a pistol grip and folding stock. and my 45 barrel is rifled and is 5". There is also a company that makes a 22 cal mp5. But maybe thats because its a 22 cal. Laws might be different in colorado than where you are.
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#84 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 08:43 PM

You are misunderstanding the laws and what was said.

View Postninja monkey, on 02 December 2010 - 09:08 PM, said:

maybe where your at, my buddy has a shot gun with a pistol grip and folding stock. and my 45 barrel is rifled and is 5". There is also a company that makes a 22 cal mp5. But maybe thats because its a 22 cal. Laws might be different in colorado than where you are.


1. A shotgun (or a rifle) can have a folding stock. What PW was saying is if the shotgun barrel length is under 18 inches, then in the eyes of the law it is either is a "short barrel shotgun" (stock, like so ) or an AOW (no stock, like so ).

Either item requires some form of tax stamp, and some states have additional requirements or restrictions (for example, in Minnesota one may legally own an NFA-registered and tax stamped "short barrel rifle," but one may not own a "short barrel shotgun" under any circumstances).

Other NFA goodies include select fire guns or suppressors.

2. If it's a handgun, you're .45 is fine. If it's a rifle (that is, has a stock and a rifled barrel), then you're in some serious BATFE trouble.

3. You're talking about the GSG-5. It's a semi-automatic rifle, because it has a 16" barrel.

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The fake suppressor covers up the rest of the barrel.

It has no special benefits for being a .22


And these laws are Federal laws. As in, applies anywhere in the 50 states.


Now, back to what I was talking about.

My "ideal" HD gun would be legally classified as a "short barrel rifle" under NFA, and thus needs the $200 tax stamp, the red tape, and the registration. Technically, if I had the cash to blow I could do it (Minnesota doesn't even have a legal definition of a "short barrel rifle," only a shotgun, so assuming federal law is met it's done). However, there's other legal nonsense for doing that, and I'm really not in the mood to go through the level of potential BATFE issues that goes with a SBR.

This post has been edited by Thalion: 02 December 2010 - 08:45 PM

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#85 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 10:48 PM

Well I raise your SBR for one with a masterkey. =o

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I'm ignorant, can you move the a2 front sight anywhere on the barrel or does it have to be over the gas block?

This post has been edited by ghostinthewood: 02 December 2010 - 10:53 PM

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#86 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 06:50 AM

The standard A2 front sight is restricted to the gas block.

It is possible to get a gas block without a sight and locate a front sight elsewhere (the other common location for them is at the front end of a railed handguard).

This post has been edited by Thalion: 03 December 2010 - 06:50 AM

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#87 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 09:03 AM

Thats what I was thinking. If I do end up scraping up cash for this M&P15 then I think I may want to get a rifle or full length handguard(i think those are the right terms) because I'm pretty sure the one on there is carbine length. If its a full length one then I could still use the front sights I would think but I didnt know how that worked out with the gas block. I didnt know it was lal one piece since I've seen a bunch of gas blocks without the sight so I assumed they were two separate units.
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#88 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 09:33 AM

Yes, the M&P15 has carbine length handguards.

With the standard A2 sight, changing to any other length isn't really doable. With a different gas block, it could be possible (though it may better to buy a different upper at this point).
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#89 User is offline   ghostinthewood 

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 09:56 AM

So could I just get a weaver front sight and gas block to change handguards or do i not need a whole new gas block, just take the a2 sight off?

I'm lost because this looks like it could just slid anywhere..

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This post has been edited by ghostinthewood: 03 December 2010 - 09:57 AM

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#90 User is offline   ninja monkey 

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 10:52 AM

Nope, there is grooves in the barrel and tapered pins that slide on those grooves and keeps it straight and aligned. I changed my gas block so I could run a front sight on the barrel. If you go bushmaster, I have a gas block that has no sight so you can add a sight. If you go back and look at my gun, you will see my upgraded gas block.
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