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Problems With The Bush Administration Lookie what I found. Rate Topic: -----

#46 User is offline   Deus Ex Machina 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 08:59 PM

For all you know he could have kept to his promise of keeping his weapons destroyed.

I mean, it's not like he complied with the destruction orders or anything.
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#47 User is offline   Flippy the Wonder Bunny 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 08:59 PM

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Problem: Habeas Corpus Denied
Article One, Section Nine of the United States Constitution states the basic human right of habeas corpus can not be suspended except for cases “of rebellion or invasion.” In September 2006, at President Bush’s urging, the Republican-led Congress passed the Military Commissions Act, which stripped terror detainees of this basic right. Thirty-three former U.S. diplomats warned “to deny habeas corpus to our detainees can be seen as prescription for how the captured members of our own military, diplomatic and NGO personnel stationed abroad may be treated.”

Last time I checked the rights that are guarenteed to US citizens do not apply to prisoners of war.

Quote

Problem: Guantanamo Bay
Since opening its doors in 2004, the U.S. detention facility at Guantanamo Bay has held—and presumably tortured—more than 500 detainees. The lack of basic legal rights—such as habeas corpus (Refer back to the first quote)—at Gitmo has been one of the White House’s biggest scandals, and has helped to ruin the U.S. reputation around the world. According to Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Adm. Mike Mullen: “More than anything else it’s been the image—how Gitmo has become around the world, in terms of representing the United States. ... I believe that from the standpoint of how it reflects on us that it’s been pretty damaging.”

Notice the word presumably in fron of tortured. Meaning that they don't really have proof.

This post has been edited by ghost93: 28 January 2008 - 09:00 PM

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#48 User is offline   JerseyPaint 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 09:05 PM

View Postdeusexmachina55, on Jan 28 2008, 10:59 PM, said:

For all you know he could have kept to his promise of keeping his weapons destroyed.

I mean, it's not like he complied with the destruction orders or anything.

Because Saddam was such a stand up guy.

Iraq was a big funder of terrorism, Afghanistan is merely the training ground for terrorism. If we choke terrorism of its funds and supplies, it cannot continue to grow. And taking down such a major power in the Middle East with such quickness, we pretty have showed every country that we can and will take them by force if they pose a threat to our and the world's well being.

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#49 User is offline   JKLNHYD 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 09:05 PM

View Postdeusexmachina55, on Jan 28 2008, 07:59 PM, said:

For all you know he could have kept to his promise of keeping his weapons destroyed.

I mean, it's not like he complied with the destruction orders or anything.



I understand what you are saying, but all of this is after the fact. There are always "ifs" involved in any of this. But, a guy, Saddam, that will kill and maim his own people, just because, is not to be trusted. What would have happened will never be known.

The biggest error was that we did not just simply assasinate these people before they could do any harm.
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#50 User is offline   Deus Ex Machina 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 09:16 PM

View PostJKLNHYD, on Jan 28 2008, 10:05 PM, said:

View Postdeusexmachina55, on Jan 28 2008, 07:59 PM, said:

For all you know he could have kept to his promise of keeping his weapons destroyed.

I mean, it's not like he complied with the destruction orders or anything.

I understand what you are saying, but all of this is after the fact. There are always "ifs" involved in any of this. But, a guy, Saddam, that will kill and maim his own people, just because, is not to be trusted. What would have happened will never be known.

The biggest error was that we did not just simply assasinate these people before they could do any harm.


True, but he had destroyed his weapons, and was years away from making his own. The least G.W. could have done was postpone the invasion until he was actually beginning to become a threat.

The fact is, the U.S. went in too soon. I don't support that, and I don't see why anyone should be criticized for not supporting it when it was the wrong idea to begin with. Simply because it was a mistake to enter in to, does not mean that you need to stay. I'd say it'd be a better strategical move for the United States to consolidate their forces.

Quote

Iraq was a big funder of terrorism, Afghanistan is merely the training ground for terrorism. If we choke terrorism of its funds and supplies, it cannot continue to grow. And taking down such a major power in the Middle East with such quickness, we pretty have showed every country that we can and will take them by force if they pose a threat to our and the world's well being


And who exactly did he fund?
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#51 User is offline   da1hobo 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 09:17 PM

I return to you to leave these words:

For as long as we shall have a president, we shall have a scape goat.

Because it is easy to criticize, but nigh impossible to understand.
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#52 User is offline   ike123 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 09:24 PM

View Postghost93, on Jan 28 2008, 07:59 PM, said:

Quote

Problem: Habeas Corpus Denied
Article One, Section Nine of the United States Constitution states the basic human right of habeas corpus can not be suspended except for cases “of rebellion or invasion.” In September 2006, at President Bush’s urging, the Republican-led Congress passed the Military Commissions Act, which stripped terror detainees of this basic right. Thirty-three former U.S. diplomats warned “to deny habeas corpus to our detainees can be seen as prescription for how the captured members of our own military, diplomatic and NGO personnel stationed abroad may be treated.”

Last time I checked the rights that are guarenteed to US citizens do not apply to prisoners of war.

Last time I checked the Geneva Conventions did. Yet we aren't giving them those either.
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#53 User is offline   Tenacious221 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 09:30 PM

View PostMastagunz, on Jan 28 2008, 08:39 PM, said:

Whats the point of this thread?


Bashing someone for doing something you don't understand...

View Postda1hobo, on Jan 28 2008, 10:17 PM, said:

I return to you to leave these words:

For as long as we shall have a president, we shall have a scape goat.

Because it is easy to criticize, but nigh impossible to understand.


I wish I could roll off another warning for you...for you are wise in the ways of logic.

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#54 Guest_SaltandVinegar_*

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 09:35 PM

He has one year left, give the guy a rest. He did great on his State of the Union speech tonight, and I give him credit. A lot of things I disagree with him on... but he was our leader, and he has earned my respect. Sure, his presidency wasn't the greatest, but in a time of global troubles, he was far from the worse.
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#55 User is offline   ike123 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 10:06 PM

Actually, i was just thinking this today: Who gives a crap anymore? He has a year left, what's done is done. No point in debating anything now, because he won't be but a speck of history in a year.
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#56 Guest_SaltandVinegar_*

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 10:10 PM

View Postike123, on Jan 28 2008, 10:06 PM, said:

Actually, i was just thinking this today: Who gives a crap anymore? He has a year left, what's done is done. No point in debating anything now, because he won't be but a speck of history in a year.


*claps*

Thank you. Ike, where you been? We haven't been in our traditional flame war in a while. :ninja:
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#57 User is offline   JKLNHYD 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 10:21 PM

View Postike123, on Jan 28 2008, 09:06 PM, said:

Actually, i was just thinking this today: Who gives a crap anymore? He has a year left, what's done is done. No point in debating anything now, because he won't be but a speck of history in a year.



But, the future looks bleak with our choice of candidates...

This post has been edited by JKLNHYD: 28 January 2008 - 10:23 PM

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#58 User is offline   ike123 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 10:21 PM

View PostSaltandVinegar, on Jan 28 2008, 09:10 PM, said:

View Postike123, on Jan 28 2008, 10:06 PM, said:

Actually, i was just thinking this today: Who gives a crap anymore? He has a year left, what's done is done. No point in debating anything now, because he won't be but a speck of history in a year.


*claps*

Thank you. Ike, where you been? We haven't been in our traditional flame war in a while. :P


Nothing of interest to me in a while. Now once the candidate's get picked, there will definetly be something interesting. :)
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#59 Guest_SaltandVinegar_*

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 10:23 PM

View Postike123, on Jan 28 2008, 10:21 PM, said:

View PostSaltandVinegar, on Jan 28 2008, 09:10 PM, said:

View Postike123, on Jan 28 2008, 10:06 PM, said:

Actually, i was just thinking this today: Who gives a crap anymore? He has a year left, what's done is done. No point in debating anything now, because he won't be but a speck of history in a year.


*claps*

Thank you. Ike, where you been? We haven't been in our traditional flame war in a while. :P


Nothing of interest to me in a while. Now once the candidate's get picked, there will definetly be something interesting. :)


Yes... now, I need to decide who I prefer... it's really hard. We need a third party.
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#60 User is offline   ike123 

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Posted 28 January 2008 - 11:00 PM

View PostSaltandVinegar, on Jan 28 2008, 09:23 PM, said:

View Postike123, on Jan 28 2008, 10:21 PM, said:

View PostSaltandVinegar, on Jan 28 2008, 09:10 PM, said:

View Postike123, on Jan 28 2008, 10:06 PM, said:

Actually, i was just thinking this today: Who gives a crap anymore? He has a year left, what's done is done. No point in debating anything now, because he won't be but a speck of history in a year.


*claps*

Thank you. Ike, where you been? We haven't been in our traditional flame war in a while. :P


Nothing of interest to me in a while. Now once the candidate's get picked, there will definetly be something interesting. :)


Yes... now, I need to decide who I prefer... it's really hard. We need a third party.


I like Obama. I think he is someone that can be bipartisan. He has been backed by the Kennedy's. He is getting young people to vote. He's young. That's what we need. America was founded by young people. America shouldn't be run by old farts who aren't in touch with the people anymore. Obama offers the most hope for America in my book.
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