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Insane air usage with HPA tank....WTF?? Rate Topic: -----

#1 User is offline   Souleater 

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Posted 23 March 2010 - 11:12 AM

So I was using a Guerilla Air tank (68/4500) w/ Myth reg, and everything seemed fine.
I recently changed the regulator to a Ninja so I could use it with a Tac 1 and immediately ran into a problem.

It seems that all of a sudden I'm using a TON of air.
With the Tac 1 in about 3/4 of a pod the pressure had dropped from 3000 psi to around 2500.
So I tried it on a 98C- Same thing- in approximately 50 shots it dropped like 2-300 psi.
Finally I tried it on my 08 Ego- rapid fire about 50 shots again dropped about 300 psi.
:thanks: :D
Now I KNOW my Ego is NOT that bad on air....
On all three tests I literally watched the pressure dial on the reg just drop.

Called AGD- the guy said he's never even heard of that happening, and to check for leaks. But there are no leaks on any of my markers, and it's a brand new reg...

So I called Ninja, and the guy said something about gun settings being off. Made no sense at all, because I have never seen tank pressure drop like this, even using my A5 with multiple different rental tanks.

The only things I can think of that may be somehow related is the reg is not at 800/850 output from the factory like they say it should be. It's more around 700/750. Which still shouldn't be any problem with the 98 and Ego.
Also the reg gauge dial seems to jump around a lot when firing.



Ideas??
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#2 User is offline   stinkfingr 

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Posted 23 March 2010 - 11:33 AM

i know it is a pain in the ass, but if the only thing that changed was the tank reg, put the myth back on it and see what kind of results you get with that .. maybe you just never noticed it before the tac1 .. but it sounds like you aren't gonna really know anything until you perform that swap and test. be sure you write down all the efficiencies you are getting now with the ninja reg.
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#3 User is offline   ger 

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Posted 23 March 2010 - 11:57 AM

If the Ninja reg is the only factor that has changed in your setup it seems to me that is the problem.
  • I know you tested the markers, but is there a leak in the Ninja reg itself?
  • Leak between tank & reg?
  • Does it lose pressure while it's mounted, not firing?
  • Does it lose any pressure when it's not mounted?
If all of those turn up "no" then you'll have to re-install the Myth & go from there.

This post has been edited by ger: 23 March 2010 - 11:57 AM

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#4 User is offline   Souleater 

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Posted 23 March 2010 - 03:29 PM

Yeah, I figured I'd have to swap back and see if it does it, but I was just trying to put it off as long as possible. I live about 1.5 hours from the nearest air fill.

Anyway-
There is a small leak that I found where the fill nipple attaches to the reg, but it's so slow I wouldn't think it would cause such a massive loss of pressure....

Other than that, no leaks.
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#5 User is offline   Florentine 

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 06:24 PM

Maybe it needs to be broken in?
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#6 User is offline   Invictusone 

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 06:27 PM

Remember, whatever you do, DO NOT PUT OIL IN THE FILL NIPPLE!

you probably already knew this but it can never hurt to make sure.
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#7 User is offline   slinkyaroo 

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 06:38 PM

Remember your ego is self regulated. Regardless of air tanks it will only take in so much air per shot. You changed the reg but you also changed the guage ..... swap the guage with your old one.




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#8 User is offline   Mehphisto 

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 08:10 PM

Did you have the stock mid output on your myth reg? If so the Ninja regs might come stock with HP (not really sure if they do) and the difference between output pressure might make a difference. Not really 100% sure if it would make a difference though.
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#9 User is offline   Legato 

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Posted 24 March 2010 - 11:42 PM

View PostMehphisto, on Mar 24 2010, 10:10 PM, said:

Did you have the stock mid output on your myth reg? If so the Ninja regs might come stock with HP (not really sure if they do) and the difference between output pressure might make a difference. Not really 100% sure if it would make a difference though.


bingo...stock output on a myth is like 650 psi, output on a ninja is 850 psi, a lot more gas per shot. Mags are gas hogs to begin with, especially x-valved ones.

How long are you waiting after a fill to test fire? Usually after a fill, most spot fail to follow regs of filling no more then 1000 psi per minute, and instead flash fill the tank in under a minute. Which causes the gas to heat up and expand more then it really is, so 10 minutes after a fill and the tank and gas cools and contracts, you may lose up to or more then 500 psi...i see it all the time at fields, really sucks when you have a small tank and it does that.

So are you waiting like a long time for the tank to "settle/balance" after the fill?

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#10 User is offline   Souleater 

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Posted 25 March 2010 - 07:21 AM

View Postslinkyaroo, on Mar 24 2010, 06:38 PM, said:

Remember your ego is self regulated. Regardless of air tanks it will only take in so much air per shot. You changed the reg but you also changed the guage ..... swap the guage with your old one.


Maybe I'm just misunderstanding- I don't see how changing the gauge would help....
Becasue the baffling thing is even though the gun only takes so much air, it still seems that the same amount is leaving the tank as with the other markers.
And the gauge doesn't seem to be reading to far off- when I took it apart last night it read around 800/1000 psi, which is about how much air sounded like it left the tank when I emptied it.


View PostLegato, on Mar 24 2010, 11:42 PM, said:

View PostMehphisto, on Mar 24 2010, 10:10 PM, said:

Did you have the stock mid output on your myth reg? If so the Ninja regs might come stock with HP (not really sure if they do) and the difference between output pressure might make a difference. Not really 100% sure if it would make a difference though.


bingo...stock output on a myth is like 650 psi, output on a ninja is 850 psi, a lot more gas per shot. Mags are gas hogs to begin with, especially x-valved ones.

How long are you waiting after a fill to test fire? Usually after a fill, most spot fail to follow regs of filling no more then 1000 psi per minute, and instead flash fill the tank in under a minute. Which causes the gas to heat up and expand more then it really is, so 10 minutes after a fill and the tank and gas cools and contracts, you may lose up to or more then 500 psi...i see it all the time at fields, really sucks when you have a small tank and it does that.

So are you waiting like a long time for the tank to "settle/balance" after the fill?



Yes, it was the stock Myth reg.

And I was expecting a bit more air use because of the X-valve, but it just still seems a little extreme for the tank pressure to drop about 500 psi in 100 shots....

As far as the tank fill- Yes, I think that's what they did- it was filled to like 4000 , and then dropped to 3000 in a very short time.
But I waited until the next day to test the marker, so it should have settled plenty.
Also I did find a small leak around the fill nipple, but it's only dropping 1-200 psi every 8+ hours.

NOW-
I took the reg apart last night to see if there was maybe anything wrong inside. Everything looked great- except that the 2 silver shims that Ninja says are supposed to be in there were not there. Which of course explains why it's only putting out 700/750 psi....

The person that suggested ckecking out the reg also says that maybe I got a lemon. In light of the missing parts, could this be a possibility?
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#11 User is offline   Souleater 

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 12:31 PM

Update:

Got the fill nipple leak straightened out. Holds air without dropping at all now. And the gauge works fine.
Guy at the shop looked at the reg, and didn't see anything wrong with it, except a little grime (and the obviously missing shims- calling Ninja about that...)

Took it back home- still seems to be doing the same thing.....
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#12 User is offline   Mehphisto 

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 12:41 PM

I really think it's the change in output pressure. Not really much you can do about that, I wouldn't really worry about it.
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