Special Ops Paintball: .50 Caliber - Special Ops Paintball

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.50 Caliber The new standard?

#61 User is offline   deltapaintball 

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Posted 27 July 2009 - 08:53 AM

View PostPuzuma, on Jul 27 2009, 10:18 AM, said:

Because of Smart Parts companies have become gun shy and innovation seems to have stopped at milling marker bodies and shaving that extra gram off.


Yeah, that's it entirely. :rolleyes:
Coming soon.
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#62 User is offline   Flippy the Wonder Bunny 

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Posted 27 July 2009 - 09:57 AM

View PostPuzuma, on Jul 27 2009, 09:18 AM, said:

View Postghost93, on Jul 27 2009, 12:12 AM, said:

View PostPuzuma, on Jul 26 2009, 10:04 PM, said:

Are you sure about that? SP seems to be able to force it's will on the paintball community quite well....

Again with the silly SP bashing, I'd expect better from an admin too.


Your blind fanboyism for SP is no better than anyone that "bashes" them.
My blind fanboyism? I'm not saying that SP is the best gun ever, I'm just saying it's annoying that you guys can't just have a discussion without SP bashing popping up. It gets really old.

How is it bashing when a statement of fact is made? Just because I'm an admin I'm not permitted to speak my mind?
How has SP forced their way on paintball? I don't see every paintball player using a SP gun, that would probably be what they want. There are plenty of other companies out there, if SP was the evil company that you are saying it is there wouldn't be. And usually isn't the modsquad supposed to keep threads on topic, not push them off of it?

Where would we be if the ASA had been patented?

How many markers would there be if Nelson and Sheridan had sued EVERYONE that used their marker as a base?

I get that a company does things to grow it's bottom line. Paintball has always been about helping the community to grow. Smart Parts doesn't seem to get that. Because of Smart Parts companies have become gun shy and innovation seems to have stopped at milling marker bodies and shaving that extra gram off.
You mean just like every other electro out there? That's not exclusive to SP. I can also show you a decent sized list of things they changed on the shocker since it came out, it isn't only milling.

Does SP make a bad product? No.

Has Smart Part actually helped the paintball community through it's actions? Also No.

And now that same company starts an ad campaign claiming they're the progenitors of the newest revolution of the game, the .50 paintball.
You mean just like SO did a few years ago? Posted Image Just because they are saying it's a new revolution doesn't mean they are evil.

Yeah, I'm VERY doubtful about their intentions. But we'll just have to wait and see what happens, won't we?

I guess we will.

This post has been edited by ghost93: 27 July 2009 - 10:26 AM

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#63 User is offline   Pirate 

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Posted 27 July 2009 - 11:09 PM

View Postdeltapaintball, on Jul 27 2009, 08:53 AM, said:

View PostPuzuma, on Jul 27 2009, 10:18 AM, said:

Because of Smart Parts companies have become gun shy and innovation seems to have stopped at milling marker bodies and shaving that extra gram off.


Yeah, that's it entirely. ;)

Well, even you have to admit that their antics haven't helped anything.

I think in regards to the actual thread, a general accord was reached. It will be a niche market, because too many people have .68cal guns that they don't want to get rid of.
Maybe in a few years, as .50cal markers/barrels are released and insurance companies accept the .50cal paintball, you'll see both paints. However, in such a situation, you'll have to see a change in rules regarding sizes of eliminating hits.
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#64 User is offline   CapnStank 

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Posted 28 July 2009 - 10:55 AM

I've been looking for a new marker and since hearing this I'm definitely going to wait to see what becomes of the 50cal. If they want to make it big they need to get their name out there. The sooner the better because if they spark any interest in a customer (as they have for me) people will be willing to wait before dumping a few hundred on a new marker.
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#65 User is offline   Flippy the Wonder Bunny 

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Posted 28 July 2009 - 11:44 AM

View PostPirate, on Jul 28 2009, 01:09 AM, said:

View Postdeltapaintball, on Jul 27 2009, 08:53 AM, said:

View PostPuzuma, on Jul 27 2009, 10:18 AM, said:

Because of Smart Parts companies have become gun shy and innovation seems to have stopped at milling marker bodies and shaving that extra gram off.


Yeah, that's it entirely. :)

Well, even you have to admit that their antics haven't helped anything.

I think in regards to the actual thread, a general accord was reached. It will be a niche market, because too many people have .68cal guns that they don't want to get rid of.
Maybe in a few years, as .50cal markers/barrels are released and insurance companies accept the .50cal paintball, you'll see both paints. However, in such a situation, you'll have to see a change in rules regarding sizes of eliminating hits.

I think it will be a lot like the .43 cal cRAP4 guns, they'll be out there and people will buy them but fields won't let you use them. Unless they keep the velocity at 300 fps insurance companies won't cover them and even if they do the fields won't carry .50 cal paint.
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#66 User is offline   deltapaintball 

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Posted 28 July 2009 - 01:00 PM

Their antics? God forbid if they ran their business like a business! Where were you when Spec Ops tried to trademark "woodsball"? What about those antics?

I have been told why a lot of interest is being put into .50 cal paintballs, however I am not confident it is for the public or not yet, so I will not answer those questions.
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#67 User is offline   Flippy the Wonder Bunny 

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Posted 28 July 2009 - 02:43 PM

View Postdeltapaintball, on Jul 28 2009, 03:00 PM, said:

Their antics? God forbid if they ran their business like a business! Where were you when Spec Ops tried to trademark "woodsball"? What about those antics?

What?? Paintball a business? It can't be, paintball isn't a business it's just a group of people making stuff. We don't have to worry about trademark laws, those are ridiculous! Posted Image
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#68 User is offline   Legato 

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Posted 28 July 2009 - 11:48 PM

View Postghost93, on Jul 28 2009, 05:43 PM, said:

View Postdeltapaintball, on Jul 28 2009, 03:00 PM, said:

Their antics? God forbid if they ran their business like a business! Where were you when Spec Ops tried to trademark "woodsball"? What about those antics?

What?? Paintball a business? It can't be, paintball isn't a business it's just a group of people making stuff. We don't have to worry about trademark laws, those are ridiculous! Posted Image


except for the fact it has nothing to do with trademarks and everything to do with fraudulently gained patents that are on stuff they NEVER INVENTED. Nor did they EVER turn in Prior Art for any of their patents though MANY companies had done, what SP was trying to patent recently, DECADES ago. They are full of crap and PB would be much better without them. /rant

You can love them, i don't care. People can like what they want. But don't act like they are in the right in any way shape or form. It is fraud and lying plain and simple.


Back to the .50 cal. I still don't see this feasibly being accepted by any major insurance companies. They can push all they want. I doubt it will be the hit they want it to be. But i guess we can only wait and see.

This post has been edited by Legato: 28 July 2009 - 11:50 PM

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#69 User is offline   Tim Burton 

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 08:18 PM

View PostMillslane, on Jul 26 2009, 07:38 PM, said:

50 Caliber won't be the new standard. It will fade and die away. If it was the new standard, basically every current player would be forced to get all new gear from Markers, Barrels and Loaders.

Are any of you interested in re-investing all your money again? I am not and I doubt most paintballers are not either. It will only become the new standard if we all deiced to make it so. No company can force it on us.



They can force it if they make it revolutionary. If the ball shoots an extra 40 yards and is accurate out to nearly that extra distance, I can see it. It'd be the difference between a smooth bore and a rifled rifle. The CSA troops mutinied to get rid of smooth bore rifles in battle. Same can happen here.

If SP was smart, they'd offer up the paint technology at an extremely low rate, like 1 cent a case. This would be like Beta Max/VHS. VHS won, because they were an open technology with little if any patent costs. Encourage everyone to get in and you're more likely to get everyone to switch, especially if it is technologically better.

They can't patent the size. It's been done, so anyone can build the guns at 50 cal.

I'd really like to see an extra 40-50 yards in shooting distance. It'd give more enjoyment to my stalking and hunting.

This post has been edited by Tim Burton: 31 July 2009 - 08:43 PM

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#70 User is offline   Lao Yan Qiang 

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 09:54 PM

Well having played against Bill and Adam Gardner, I can tell you they are not honorable people. But anyone who has ever seen the video from the first (and last) Reno, NV NPPL knows that. As far as their patents go, the majority of them are about as valid as their first one. Surely you don't think that they were the first ones to put holes in a barrel in which ......."the sum of the cross sectional area of all apertures in the barrel exceeds the cross sectional area of the barrel itself". (that is patent talk for saying all the holes we drilled have more surface area than the end of the barrel.) They weren't. But they sued (or threatened to) a lot of people over it. They are pretty clever guys though. And damn good players. That don't need to cheat to win. They just do.

As far as GI Milsim goes, I find it laughable and the height of hypocrisy that the guys who brought you the NPPL and X-Ball have suddenly decided that that Milsim is the place to be. What happened? Couldn't get everybody to buy into the politically correct, 30 ball a second, temper tantrum filled, cheat fest they were promoting? Hey, you created boys. You wasted tens of millions of dollars of sponsorship dollars marketing it. Live with it. (or what is left of it.)

And .50 cal? The name of the game is cheap paint. If you can't afford to shoot 10,000 rounds a day of .68 caliber, maybe you can afford to shoot 10,000 rounds of .50 cal. You know you want to. You can never shoot too much paint, can you? Not if you want to WIN ! It is cheaper to make, it is cheaper to store, it is cheaper to ship, and it is cheaper to make guns for it. 1/2 inch is standard material. 11/16 (.6875 caliber) is not. It takes less material too.

Now those of us who have shot .43 cal,.50 cal, .55 cal, and .62 cal will tell you that ballisticaly they suck when compared to .68 caliber. But of all the things you can say about Bill, Adam, and Richmond, you can't say they are stupid. So I am giving them the benefit of the doubt that they actually have something new that will make a .50 caliber ball at least equal to a.68 caliber ball. Because if they don't, all they have is cheap. And cheap paint isn't that important. Is it? :blink:
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#71 User is offline   deltapaintball 

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 10:05 PM

And you are?
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#72 User is offline   Flippy the Wonder Bunny 

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 10:29 PM

My guess is a liar.

Wow, having actually read your post now I'm going to request that you leave SOF forever, kthxbai.

View PostLao Yan Qiang, on Jul 31 2009, 11:54 PM, said:

Well having played against Bill and Adam Gardner, I can tell you they are not honorable people. But anyone who has ever seen the video from the first (and last) Reno, NV NPPL knows that. As far as their patents go, the majority of them are about as valid as their first one. Surely you don't think that they were the first ones to put holes in a barrel in which ......."the sum of the cross sectional area of all apertures in the barrel exceeds the cross sectional area of the barrel itself". (that is patent talk for saying all the holes we drilled have more surface area than the end of the barrel.) They weren't. But they sued (or threatened to) a lot of people over it. They are pretty clever guys though. And damn good players. That don't need to cheat to win. They just do.
And your basing this on what? Who are you exactly that you have played with the Gardners?

As far as GI Milsim goes, I find it laughable and the height of hypocrisy that the guys who brought you the NPPL and X-Ball have suddenly decided that that Milsim is the place to be. What happened? Couldn't get everybody to buy into the politically correct, 30 ball a second, temper tantrum filled, cheat fest they were promoting? Hey, you created boys. You wasted tens of millions of dollars of sponsorship dollars marketing it. Live with it. (or what is left of it.)
Yep, they are completely leaving speedball. Thats why they are making the Impulse and Luxe and sponsoring teams. The cap for most major leagues has never gone above 15 with ramping by the way. Now can you leave with your speedball hate? Because this also has nothing to do with .50 caliber paint.

And .50 cal? The name of the game is cheap paint. If you can't afford to shoot 10,000 rounds a day of .68 caliber, maybe you can afford to shoot 10,000 rounds of .50 cal. You know you want to. You can never shoot too much paint, can you? Not if you want to WIN ! It is cheaper to make, it is cheaper to store, it is cheaper to ship, and it is cheaper to make guns for it. 1/2 inch is standard material. 11/16 (.6875 caliber) is not. It takes less material too.
Okay seriously, I go through less than a case of paint on a normal day of play. Thats practicing for tournaments too. So if you are shooting that much I don't know what kind of paintball you are playing.

Now those of us who have shot .43 cal,.50 cal, .55 cal, and .62 cal will tell you that ballisticaly they suck when compared to .68 caliber. But of all the things you can say about Bill, Adam, and Richmond, you can't say they are stupid. So I am giving them the benefit of the doubt that they actually have something new that will make a .50 caliber ball at least equal to a.68 caliber ball. Because if they don't, all they have is cheap. And cheap paint isn't that important. Is it? :blink:

Meh, the different calibers may be worse but they may not be too. We'll have to wait and see on that one.

This post has been edited by ghost93: 31 July 2009 - 10:37 PM

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#73 User is offline   Mr.Flint 

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Posted 01 August 2009 - 12:21 AM

What SP done, and doing with their patents, is called Patent Trolling, and a rather common nasty occurrence. AFAIK the latest victim of such practice was Research In Motion, and they had to settle with the patent troll for 60+ million dollars.

.50 cal a revolution? unlikely. SP trying to carve a bigger market for themselves? likely. will it succeed? as much as cRAP4 did.
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#74 User is offline   Flippy the Wonder Bunny 

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Posted 01 August 2009 - 12:15 PM

They see SP trollin, they hatin. :D

SP already has a decent sized market.
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#75 User is offline   CamoDeafie 

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Posted 01 August 2009 - 12:38 PM

Lao Yan Qiang......he's one of the older players, played in big name tourneys in the 90s....I believe he's mentioned that he used to be in the NPPL a long time ago....and the Gardner Brothers were part of the All Americans in the 90s as well...so I think he's basing his opinions on his experience with them, not just some hearsay, or forum defending/offending......he's got a point about the SP thing....the name of the game is to get MONEY. if they cant get EVERYONE into what makes money, they might as well as jump into Scenario, but nowhere in his post does it say that SP's moving entirely into scenario and abandoning speedball/tourneyball.... what better to dominate the market than to open up into the scenario thing and make $$$? I mean, they already tried with the SP8, ok that wasnt as successful as it couldve been..now the SP-1, its pretty successful, so if its successful, then why not expand? I dont see a problem with that...except for what SP did in the past but that doesnt stop me from seeing why they could be successful in scenario/woods.....after all, they did used to have the camo Renegade jerseys, CHigos, remotes with regulators, T stocks, camo colored splash kits, automags, autocockers, even *GASPS!* wood grips for 45 frames and early M16 frames...they also sold Sterlings a long time ago.....as third party distributors. as for .50 cal thats now up to the players and fields' insurances....
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