Special Ops Paintball: Dangers of shipping bottles dont do it - Special Ops Paintball

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Dangers of shipping bottles dont do it

#1 User is offline   Guy In Digi Camo 

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Posted 24 March 2009 - 03:40 PM

This was a posting originally from an alaska forum but it would be wise to litsen to his advice, his name is speedyboat on our forum

Heres his story

ok so about 2 years ago I left state like some of you who know me knew.speedyboat=(AXEL) When I came back up here I had someone send me my air tanks, I had 2 68/3000's that I used in tha mail like I thought was the right thing to do and a couple other items.this postal inspector found out they were in there and had a couple hundred psi left in 1 of them he called me and I told him they were mine and asked when I could get them and he just dodged my question and disapeared for a year then last summer he came to my house and made me sign pictures of the items saying they were mine.earlyer this winter I was served with papers sayin I had to go to court so I showed up, and these people were tryin to make me seen like a terrorist and I was trying to "mame" someone.when I talked to this inspector I told him they were fine that as far as I knew the tanks could hold double the amount there were rated for and a couple psi was fine.and in court he said I said they would blow up if in a plane andthe package would hurt anyone that picked it up. The prosecuter said she wanted $10,000 bail which was f'ed up they automaticly wanted me to go to jail but I posted bail pleaded not guilty for charges of "causing unmailible items to be mailed" These people lied to try to get me in trouble and get money outa me! at the time I had no job so they gave me a public defender,I told this public PRETENDER that this inspecter is lying and I will take a lie detector test anyday because I never said what he said I said! This crap TINKLEes me off so bad! so this lawyer they gave me said to plead guilty that I would only get probation. so I did what she said and I ended up sitting in jail for a long butt time getting attacked, fighting for my life ,hoping I didnt end up with permanent brain damage because of all the fighting.jail is full of people that just wanna fight for no reason and they dont get in trouble because its considered mutual combat and all they do is take away your phone time.So ifyou are sending you tanks in the mail let your pressure out!!! please so you dont have to go through what I did.prison is a big test of patience and I wouldnt wish it on my worst enemy but these people in the leagal system are crooks lyers and I think crimanals. And if you ever get charges and someone is lyin on you get a real lawyer
Going to be in Alaska check out my up to date post where you can get your questions answeredAlaska
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#2 User is offline   MedicOni 

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Posted 24 March 2009 - 06:44 PM

He would do better if he wrote in real sentences. And it's perfectly fine to mail tanks as long as they are empty. I know I've done it many times, along with buying tanks and having them mailed to me. Usually UPS doesn't care, so send through them
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#3 User is offline   shadow_772 

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Posted 25 March 2009 - 08:05 AM

I agree with Medic there...

Punctuation is a wonderful thing...

Why would you send a full tank in the first place.. Its not that hard to empty them, but I suppose if you were going to, then this tells you that you shouldn't.
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#4 User is offline   5N1P3R 

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Posted 25 March 2009 - 04:54 PM

When I tried to bring my tanks with me over the airplane, they wouldn't let me. I completely drained them, but they told me I need to be able to take it apart. They said they need to be able to fit there finger inside the canister? And I do not know how to do that on the spot? Kinda sucked, because I had to leave it at the airport.
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#5 User is offline   MedicOni 

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Posted 25 March 2009 - 04:57 PM

View PostW00DSBALL 5N1P3R, on Mar 25 2009, 05:54 PM, said:

When I tried to bring my tanks with me over the airplane, they wouldn't let me. I completely drained them, but they told me I need to be able to take it apart. They said they need to be able to fit there finger inside the canister? And I do not know how to do that on the spot? Kinda sucked, because I had to leave it at the airport.

Then you should have been better prepared. The requirements for taking an air cylinder onto an aircraft is all over the internet. IT's no one elses problem that you didn't research what you needed to do.
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#6 User is offline   thisissparta 

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Posted 25 March 2009 - 05:54 PM

Also, they're right about the whole 'exploding on a plane' bit, at the lower pressure of the upper atmosphere that a plane flies in, 300 PSI at sea level will increase, possibly becoming dangerous.

I know that an HPA tank has two burst disks and is rated to way beyond 3000 PSI, but the shipping co. does have some reason. It could very well be unsafe.

If the dude would have shipped them empty, taking five or six seconds to drain them, he would be perfectly okay.
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#7 User is offline   Gilla 

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Posted 25 March 2009 - 07:00 PM

Empty tanks is the easiest way. I wonder if he had specified ground mail if it wouldn't have gone better too. Longer to get but safer... I don't think I'd ever try to take one on a plane.

A good heads up for everyone though.
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#8 User is offline   shadow_772 

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 07:49 AM

View PostGilla, on Mar 25 2009, 07:00 PM, said:

Empty tanks is the easiest way. I wonder if he had specified ground mail if it wouldn't have gone better too. Longer to get but safer... I don't think I'd ever try to take one on a plane.

A good heads up for everyone though.

I would just ship them to someone I knew wherever I was going if possible. If not, pull the regulator off.
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#9 User is offline   Guy In Digi Camo 

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 07:07 PM

the tank only had a little air in it about 100psi so he might have looked at the gauge and thought it was empty, i just dont think he deserved the 2months he spent in prison for making a mistake like that.

I dont think the tank could possibly explode even if the plane was heated up to 90 degrees and the plane wasnt preassurized, it just wouldnt expand from 100 to over 7500 psi, which my myth regs burst disk is for since i have a 4500 tank.
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#10 User is offline   MedicOni 

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 11:54 PM

View PostGuy In Digi Camo, on Apr 7 2009, 08:07 PM, said:

the tank only had a little air in it about 100psi so he might have looked at the gauge and thought it was empty, i just dont think he deserved the 2months he spent in prison for making a mistake like that.

I dont think the tank could possibly explode even if the plane was heated up to 90 degrees and the plane wasnt preassurized, it just wouldnt expand from 100 to over 7500 psi, which my myth regs burst disk is for since i have a 4500 tank.

When it is something that serious, you should take precautions to make sure that something bad will not happen. That means not just looking at the gauge, it means actively seeing if your tank is empty
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#11 User is offline   SpudCrushr 

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 05:01 PM

View PostMedicOni, on Mar 25 2009, 07:57 PM, said:

View PostW00DSBALL 5N1P3R, on Mar 25 2009, 05:54 PM, said:

When I tried to bring my tanks with me over the airplane, they wouldn't let me. I completely drained them, but they told me I need to be able to take it apart. They said they need to be able to fit there finger inside the canister? And I do not know how to do that on the spot? Kinda sucked, because I had to leave it at the airport.

Then you should have been better prepared. The requirements for taking an air cylinder onto an aircraft is all over the internet. IT's no one elses problem that you didn't research what you needed to do.


Yep, that's why you mail them to the place you're going.

..just make sure they are empty. BTW, I've shipped about 10-15 tanks so far
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#12 User is offline   cdrinkh20 

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Posted 08 February 2010 - 06:20 PM

View PostSpudCrushr, on Apr 10 2009, 05:01 PM, said:

View PostMedicOni, on Mar 25 2009, 07:57 PM, said:

View PostW00DSBALL 5N1P3R, on Mar 25 2009, 05:54 PM, said:

When I tried to bring my tanks with me over the airplane, they wouldn't let me. I completely drained them, but they told me I need to be able to take it apart. They said they need to be able to fit there finger inside the canister? And I do not know how to do that on the spot? Kinda sucked, because I had to leave it at the airport.

Then you should have been better prepared. The requirements for taking an air cylinder onto an aircraft is all over the internet. IT's no one elses problem that you didn't research what you needed to do.


Yep, that's why you mail them to the place you're going.

..just make sure they are empty. BTW, I've shipped about 10-15 tanks so far


Does this apply to CO2? I bought my first gun used and they shipped me two CO2 canisters (24 and 20 oz)...both had CO2 still inside, and their O-rings didn't even work properly :P

I was like oh crap that might have been bad for me...potentially.
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#13 User is offline   UWANNAGO 

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Posted 08 February 2010 - 07:14 PM

He should have just read the paper and realized he was in trouble, refused to sign and tell them those are the wrong ones. Nothing would have happened, thats assuming he can read though...his posts suggests otherwise.

He basically signed something saying yes I had these items which are punishable by law to mail.

I have mailed full tanks and never had an issues and I have taken tanks on planes they were always fine...the guy
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#14 User is offline   Tommikka 

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Posted 09 February 2010 - 02:21 PM

1 - Watch TechPBs video 'Tanks on a plane' on YouTube
I won't directly link to it in case he uses rude words as I'm not going to watch it again at the moment to check it is within the rules for linking.

2 - Act responsibly regarding pressurised containers (Both HPA and CO2)

3 - Read the bottle notes below taken from TechPBs PDF linked with the YouTube video
http://www.techpb.com/images/hpa.pdf

4 - Read the UKPSF HPA details below (Though note the legal points and Pi mark are for UK bottles -- The general safety is the same)
www.ukpsf.com/documents/hpa.pdf

5 - If you want to play with serious items such as paintball markers and presurrised gas (HPA or CO2) then act like a responsible person who is allowed to do so.

"www.techpb.com" said:

This article is to address the numerous questions regarding traveling with CO2 & HPA
tanks. This article is written with years of experience I have gained, traveling to events with
compressed air cylinders, playing the event, and traveling safely back home. If you follow the
instructions in this guide, you should have no problems or issues traveling with your paintball
air tanks.
Q) What is the policy on traveling with paintball tanks on an airplane?
A) The regulator / valve must be removed from the bottle.
Q) How do I remove the regulator / valve from the tank?
A) In most cases, the regulator is locktited onto the bottle using RED locktite. Red Locktite is an
extremely powerful thread sealant, and is nearly impossible to remove the regulator from your
bottle without special tools. Paintball tank manufacturers have specially designed vices,
strapwrenches and tools to remove the regulator without damaging it. Most likely if you
attempt to remove the regulator yourself, you will damage your reg. The tools needed to
properly remove the regulator cost more than the tank itself.
Q) What if I try to remove the regulator myself?
A) Most likely you will damage your regulator at worst, or at best, severely scratch or scar it.
Q) So what's the best method to remove the regulator?
A) You will need to send your tank back to the manufacturer who made your regulator.
Crossfire should be shipped to Crossfire, Ninja to Ninja, Custom Products to Custom Products,
Guerrilla Air to Guerrilla Air, PMI to Paintball Solutions, etc.
Q) How long does it take?
A) It can take a week or two to get your tank back, depending on the workload. Always call
ahead to see if you need an RMA number
Q) Once the tank comes back with the regulator not attached, do I need to re‐locktite it?
A) No, as long there is at least 600+ psi in the tank, it will be extremely difficult to unscrew the
regulator from the tank in normal operation. Once the air pressure drops below 600psi, you will
be able to unscrew the tank from the regulator by hand
Q) I'm really afraid to do this, my tank tends to get stuck in the ASA, what do I do?
A) You should purchase a bottle of Triflow from www.macrolineguy.com and lubricate the
threads of your tank. ASA's without bleed tend to be most difficult to screw in and out
(Tippmanns, Mini's, Proto SLG, etc). Just put two drops on the tank threads, one drop on the
tank oring, you will be good to go
Q) Should I put a drop of Triflow on the regulator where it screws into the bottle?
A) Absolutely not, you should never put any oil, lubricant or fluid inside your tank. At 4500psi
most oils are highly combustible and your tank will explode.
Q) I accidentally put oil on the back of the regulator where it screws into the bottle, what
should I do?
A) Ship it to the tank manufacturer ASA for inspection and cleaning, DO NOT AIR IT UP!! Even a
single drop of oil inside of your tank can combust, and cause a life threatening explosion.
Nothing should ever go inside your tank, you tank should always be bone dry, free of oils,
lubricants and any other foreign objects
Q) Ok, I just got the tank back with the regulator seperated, now what do I do?
A) Nothing, just put air in it, a drop of triflow on the threads, and go play paintball
Q) Since there is no locktite, won't the regulator unscrew from the tank?
A) The air pressure inside the tank holds the regulator in place, it will not unscrew. Even at
1000psi, there is 200 pounds of force against the back of the regulator holding it in place. Just
air it up, and go play paintball
Q) I'm still nervous about this, I'm afraid my regulator will unscrew from my tank
A) When you go play paintball, most people screw the tank into the gun, and play. At the end of
the day, they unscrew the tank from the gun. The regulator is NOT going to unscrew from the
tank on it's own. Let's pretend at the end of the day, your tank is empty, and your regulator
does unscrew from the tank, once you hit about 2 or 3 turns, the air will bleed from from the
tank around your regulator. You have nothing to worry about
Q) Am I allowed to bring the tank on the plane, in my carry on baggage?
A) As long as the regulator is removed, you can bring the tank and regulator on the plane. Your
paintball gun has be checked it. Meaning, you cannot bring your paintball gun in your carry on
baggage. You must go to the service counter, and check your marker in.
Q) Do I have to declare that there is a paintball gun in my check‐in baggage?
A) Most of the time, you don't have to say anything for domestic flights. Internationally,
however can be a different story. When in doubt, tell the baggage counter the contents of your
bag.
Q) So tanks are allowed in my carry‐on baggage, but paintball guns must be checked?
A) That is correct. However, I HIGHLY recommend you just put your tank, regulator and
paintball gun in your checked baggage. Nothing is more embarrassing than holding up a 500
person line as they rummage through your carry‐on baggage. Just put it all in your checked
baggage.
Q) I'm sitting in my seat, the plane is about the depart. I realize I left my regulator on the tank,
and my tank is filled to 4500psi. What do I do?
A) Unless you want to risk your tank blowing a burst disk and forcing the plane to emergency
land, I would immediately make your way to the front of the plane, and tell the flight
attendants that you have a filled compressed air cylinder in your bag, and you need to have
your bag removed from the luggage compartment. Yes you will cause a scene, yes you will
delay the plane, and yes you will most likely miss your flight.
Q) What's the worst thing that can happen if I cross my fingers, and keep my mouth shut?
A) The skin of an aircraft is very thin. If you tank blows a burst disk and sends 4500psi of air into
a sealed luggage container, you risk everything from an emergency landing, structural failure of
the aircraft, or even worse the airplane breaks apart and you are killed. Most car tires would
blow apart at 100psi. We're talking 4,500 psi. Your car tires operate at 35psi, your bike tires
operate at 40psi. Your paintball tank can hold 4,500psi. That's over one hundred times the
operating pressure of your car tires. Now imagine this massive force unleashing inside a sealed
luggage container.
Q) I once flew with my tank regulator attached to my bottle and I didn't get in trouble
A) Well thanks for putting everyone's life in danger (including your own). Maybe we as paintball
players should start lobbying the NTSA and FAA to require a mandatory sentence of 30 days in
prison and a $10,000 fine to ANYONE caught flying with a sealed compressed air cylinder.
Q) How come you can ship tanks via AirMail with the regulators attached, but you can't bring
them on a passenger airplane?
A) Cargo planes have understandably less stringent rules when it comes to shipping items. A
passenger plane can hold 400 people, there are 3 to 5 people on a cargo plane, big difference in
liability and risk. Also, cargo planes have shipping containers that are designed to handle such
things as pressure releases in case something goes wrong, passenger planes do not.
Q) So I can ship my tank via AirMail without removing the regulator?
A) Yes, you can ship the tank with the regulator attached, AS LONG AS IT IS EMPTY!
Q) What if it's full?
A) Empty it
Q) What's the best way to empty a tank?
A) Pull the macroline off your ASA, screw in your tank and let the air blast out until it stops
Q) What's the best way to ship the tank to the hotel I'm staying at?
A) The best way is to drain the tank, put it in a box, and bring it to the post office. You will need
to prepare TWO labels.
Label 1 = Shipping from your house to the hotel + stamp
Label 2 = shipping from the hotel to your house + stamp
You will need to put Label 2 + stamp in a safe place, and you will need to bring it with you on
the plane. On sunday evening, drain your tank, put it in the box, seal it up, and place Label 2 +
Stamp on the box to ship the tank back to your house, from the hotel. Hand your box to the
hotel staff, and ask them to give it to the postman on Monday.
Q) Don't I need to remove the regulator to ship the tank?
A) No, you just need to drain the air
Q) What if at the event, my tank company is present, and they remove the reg for me?
A) Well, you can now bring your tank and reg in your checked baggage and you don't have to
ship it. You bought the second stamp for nothing. It's paintball, it's not cheap. Life moves on
Q) What about CO2 tanks?
A) CO2 tanks MUST be locktited because most do not have the safety features of the HPA tank
regulator. When a CO2 tank valve unscrews from the bottle, the bottle becomes a powered
rocket. This has killed and injured people in the past. You need to be EXTREMELY careful with
CO2 tanks. Personally, I would NOT remove the valve on a CO2 tank. Drain it, and ship it.
Q) So the safest thing to do with CO2 tanks is to ship them?
A) Correct, do not remove the CO2 valve pin. Ship it or buy another one at the event. They are
$20 for a 20 ounce CO2 tank.
Be safe, use your head, don't take chances that put people's lives in danger. Hope this helps!
Mike Phillips
www.techpb.com




"UKPSF" said:

High Pressure Air - Paintball Safety Information Guide (HPA 1)
Basic Guidelines
• Never under any circumstances dismantle your bottle regulator.
• Remember the test date on your bottle is not the be all and end all, just because your bottle is in date
does not mean that it is safe. If you have tampered with the regulator you should not use or fill your
cylinder until it has been inspected by a competent person approved by the manufacturer.
• Pressure vessels should be inspected annually by the competent person approved by the
manufacturer. Get in touch with the manufacturer to find out who they are. Although this may not be
law, it is highly recommended.
• People who have played for years are NOT competent people approved by the manufacturer.
Competent is meant in the legal sense, not in the sense that someone is good at something.
• Protect the fibre wrap on your bottle with a bottle cover, any nicks in the fibre wrap mean the bottle is
useless and should be destroyed.
• Always fit a dust cover on the fill nipple of your bottle to stop dirt getting into the regulator, or the filling
station. Dirt is the number one reason for nipple "O" rings leaking and faults with the reg.
• Never ever use oil or grease anywhere near the fill nipple. If your fill nipple is leaking, send it off to the
manufacturer to replace, you are not qualified to change the "O" ring yourself
• Make sure that the source of air that you use to fill your bottle is set to deliver air slowly. Bottle fires
require heat to occur, the slower the bottle fills, the less likelihood there is for heat to be generated.
Your bottle should take around 30 seconds for a 0.8L 3000psi to fill, and much longer for a 4500psi
1.1 or 1.5. Be especially careful if you are using an unregulated fill station attached to a dive bottle.
• If your regulator was thread locked on when you bought it, and for some reason you have removed the
regulator from the bottle, maybe to fly to another country, the chances are that you have damaged the
threads in the bottle and it could be useless. If this is the case, please contact the manufacturer of the
bottle and ask them to give you the details for the person who can measure the threads for you to
make sure they are still in tolerance.
• Regulators should NEVER be screwed in hand tight to the bottle. All regulators must be torqued tight
to the manufacturer’s specifications; again these will be available from the manufacturer.
• Never under any circumstances use oil or grease in or around your regulator. It is especially important
to ensure that the fill nipple on your regulator is free of oil and grease. Oil or grease increase the risk
of a bottle fire which can occur under certain conditions, especially when the bottle is being filled too
fast and heat is being produced as a result of the high flow of air.
• Your bottle has a date either stamped into it, or laminated under the surface. This date is very
important. Bottles need to be hydrostatically tested at set intervals to be used legally in the UK. On the
reverse of this guide are details of test dates specific to your bottle Please remember that it is YOU
who is legally responsible for the maintenance and compliance of your pressure equipment, not the
place you go to have the bottle filled or the manufacturer of the equipment.
• Under no circumstances should you hold a stream of air against your skin. On/Off valves enable users
to vent their cylinders, if you do vent your cylinder (for traveling etc), you must keep the air flow away
from your skin. A medical condition known as an embolism could occur if the air flow travels through
your skin and into your blood supply. An embolism can be fatal.
FIVE YEARS FOR FULL-FIBRE WRAPPED BOTTLES - EN12245 and Pi certified.
THREE YEARS FOR FULL WRAPPED BOTTLES - HSE-AL-FW2 manufactured before July 2003 then five
years after re-testing for SCI and Luxfer cylinders
THREE YEARS FOR FULL WRAPPED BOTTLES - HSE-AL-FW1
FIVE YEARS FOR HALF WRAP BOTTLES
FIVE YEARS FOR ALUMINUM OR STEEL BOTTLES
Notes and amendments
The new European regulations (TPED) came onto the statute book in July 2003 and at that point the UK
specification HSE-AL-FW2 became obsolete ie. No new cylinders could be produced to this specification
for the UK market.
From July 2003, the European standard EN 12245 became the only acceptable specification for new
cylinders.
All cylinders manufactured and certified to the HSE-AL-FW2 specification prior to July 2003 and retested
after July 2003 have their re test period extended from 3 to 5 years at their next re test.
If you have a cylinder manufactured before July 2003 then you need to have it tested 3 years from the
original manufactured date. The re-certified cylinder will then need re testing after a further five year period.
All cylinders manufactured to EN 12245 and Pi certified to comply with the TPED start with a re test period
of 5 years from date of manufacture.
Steel and Aluminum cylinders
In March 2002, European standards for cylinder testing were changed. The familiar old BS 5430 part 1
(steel cylinders) & part 3 (aluminum) were withdrawn and replaced by new standards - BS EN 1968:2002
for Steel Gas Containers, and BS EN 1802:2002 for Aluminum Gas Containers.
It should be added that any other cylinders manufactured and certified to other specifications e.g. DOT are
not legal in the UK
At the end of the cylinders working life, the cylinder should be destroyed as extensions cannot be made.
All air systems should be transported empty.
The filling of Paintball Cylinders should not be done by anyone under the age of 18.
Remember Safety Starts With YOU

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#15 User is offline   MAVERICK2008 

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 09:52 AM

I ship here @ SO, and we ship all tanks and receive them from the manufacturer empty, that is the key. I air fright to all over the world and never had a problem.
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