Special Ops Paintball: Tacticool 6 : Top Sniper Competitions - Special Ops Paintball

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Tacticool 6 : Top Sniper Competitions Rate Topic: -----

#16 User is offline   Tyger 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 03:42 PM

View PostLt.Col.Vortex, on 11 August 2011 - 12:56 PM, said:

And your ranting can be summed up with this...your not a sniper, you cant do this stufff...sorry.

Oh really now?

I'm torn right now. A part of me wants to rip this guy up one side and down the other. The other part of me knows it's an exercise in futility. I could do it, but it'd solve nothing.

How about I say this. Out of every paintball sniper I've met, virtually and real life, NONE of them have been trained in the craft of paintball sniping. I've met ONE who was military trained, and he spent the better part of 12 hours crawling into position to take one shot at an opposing general in his fort. The rest bought the marketing.

I've seen MANY "paintball snipers" come and go, all making the same arguments. So I'll tell ya what. Video going up later today, JUST FOR YOU guys.

And just FYI, I *can* "do this stufff". I may be old, have bad knees and be overweight for my height but I still got it. I believe my FPS series speaks for itself. "But that was like 6 years ago!" Sure. You never lose your skills.

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#17 User is offline   Warpaint 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 03:48 PM

View PostThe Stuntman, on 11 August 2011 - 04:30 PM, said:

:laugh:
Oh...its been too long since the "Great Internet PB Sniper Debate" raised its ugly little head around here. Always good for a chuckle or two...
:laugh:


These are among the more entertaining threads...I think the arguments come from misunderstandings of sniping from both pro and con camps. Sniper evolved from a word used to describe hunters who tested their skills by shooting very small, elusive birds called Snipes. The guns these hunters used weren't capable of any astounding accuracy or distance, it was the skill of the hunter that determined success. You bagged a few Snipes, and you became known as a sniper. Sniping in the combat sense as most of us know it now, is a guerrilla warfare technique of engaging the enemy. True, snipers now used specialized weapons to engage their targets, but insurgent snipers in the Middle East have effectively taken out targets from rooftops across the street and with unmodified AK47s. Back in our own Civil War, snipers engaged the enemy with the same rifles issued to every other soldier...these men were simply better shots than the average soldier, and used the hit and slip away guerrilla tactic associated with modern day snipers. When the Sharps rifles were invented, sniping took on a new importance and capability in combat. Really, it's not so much the man or the rifle, so much as the skills and techniques applied. And distance is an element of stealth.
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#18 User is offline   reef geek 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 04:05 PM

This whole conversation is not a debate. It's filled with to many logical fallacies to be a valid debate. Tyger, quit flapping your gums. There is no reason for you to be hating of snipers, we did nothing to you. I doubt you really even know what a sniper is. To be a sniper doesn't only have to do with sharp shooting. The actual shot is only 10% of being a sniper. The other 90% is the actual getting into the position to take that shot, this takes concealment, tactics, and endurance. I hate to brake it to you, but you can do those things in paint ball. Another thing, the compony that set up this forum says there are paint ball snipers. Do your research before going into a debate, and quit flapping your gums without facts to support them. Link: http://articles.spec...ambush-sniper/.
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#19 User is offline   Tyger 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 04:36 PM

View Postreef geek, on 11 August 2011 - 06:05 PM, said:

This whole conversation is not a debate. It's filled with to many logical fallacies to be a valid debate. Tyger, quit flapping your gums. There is no reason for you to be hating of snipers, we did nothing to you. ... Another thing, the compony that set up this forum says there are paint ball snipers. Do your research before going into a debate, and quit flapping your gums without facts to support them. Link: http://articles.spec...ambush-sniper/.

User's first post and he's flaming me and my sniper stance. No, that's not suspicious at all.

"Flapping your gums"? Really? I'm gonna guess you're one of the "ACES" guys or similar, someone who has a LOT to lose if "paintball sniper" loses it's luster. So 20+ years practical experience is nothing for you guys, huh? Ok, fair enough, I'd be skeptical of an old guy who's worn the camouflage off his first set of BDU's too.

So if a company says it's true, that means it's all true? Hmm, so by that logic, if I buy DYE or Valken's gear then I'm tactical? It would explain products like the "Ego" then. You just proved my point that it's marketing! Again. YOU ARGUED MY POINT FOR ME! The company says it's true, so it must be, that's called MARKETING. And yes, I'm biting the hand that feeds. But when they sponsored my show back a few years ago they know that I don't pull punches and I don't sell hype. That's what they liked about me. When they set up this subforum they knew that I'd have opinions that opposed theirs, and they welcomed it. One of many reasons I like SO as a company, actually.

Video tonight. I look forward to your video response to it.
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#20 User is offline   Cuy'val Dar  

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 04:57 PM

View PostThalion, on 11 August 2011 - 02:17 PM, said:

View PostLt.Col.Vortex, on 11 August 2011 - 02:04 PM, said:

Get off your high horse and take a joke.


In order to be a joke, it has to be funny.



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#21 User is offline   alexspawn3000 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 05:05 PM

"I would be really low key on the field, off the field..."

I cannot agree more Tyger. However, i know you have always been a skeptic of the word SNIPER...DUN DUN DUN!

Call it what you want, sniper, assassin, shadow whatever... when I am getting in my ghillie and watching people walk 5 feet, yes 5 FEETTTTTTTT OMFG 12inchesx5= 60inches away from me and they have no idea where I am, it is the best adrenaline rush. Its that game of cat and mouse and the fact that you are outsmarting your opponent.

This style of play is FAR different than running around in your padded dye pants with your 27.3456917569 bps marker with eye and drop forward and awesome trigger, supah fast loader and 4pod ball carrier with stretchy elastic... Instead you wear a bushy suit with an insanly large gun that looks and feels like a rifle that people criticise and make fun of you before the game for wearing a giant pubic hair suit...then when they walk right by you and get 1, yes ONE paintball to the back, side, face wherever you choose. THEN after the game, i love the SILENCE...yes the pure SILENCE that the opposing team displays. it is glorious. Then I sit behind my paintball mask grining, because "I find their lack of faith...disturbing!"

Here are dictionary.com defenitions of snipe and sniper:

Snipe: 3. a shot, usually from a hidden position
5. to shoot at individuals as opportunity offers from a concealed or distant position: The enemy was sniping from the roofs.

Sniper: a rifleman who fires from a concealed place, esp a military marksman who fires from cover usually at long ranges at individual enemy soldiers

Usually: customarily; at most times; in the ordinary course of events

Most: in the majority of instances

See where I am going with this? MOST snipers shoot far away, not ALL, all snipers shoot concealed, not most, so paintball snipers that are concealed, and shoot people within 150feet, are classified as snipers. :D


I also agree with the fact that it is a SELLING phrase, or word. When some kid sees SNIPER GUN! he goes, OOH WOW I can shoot SUPAH FAR! Actually I cannot count the number of people that ask me how FAR my gun shoots. I always reply, same as that gun (as I point to their own marker). Sniping is an art, it is not something everyone can do. It takes patience, timing, skill, luck, and some good ol nerves of steel!

With the advent of first strikes, the whole range debate can be argued more on the sniper side. I, however, have never used them. and buying or modding my guns to shoot them is very pricey. For me it's not the range factor, but the sneak factor. Nothing is more intimidating than a ghillie who breaks through your lines and rips your team apart. One game, for instance, I completely obliterated the left side of the field (with help from my TEAM's distracting fire) and we won the game. Notice how i emphasized TEAM. Yes, I did the actual "sniping" but without my teams support, they may have spotted me in that instance.

the point I am making is, weather you believe in paintball snipers or not, WE ARE OUT THERE!

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This post has been edited by alexspawn3000: 11 August 2011 - 05:11 PM

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#22 User is offline   reef geek 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 05:09 PM

Dude I don't have anything to loose if sniper looses it's luster, and yes I'm from A.C.E.S. Now you going against your own logic; you said earlier that titles don't mater, but now you are saying that we "loose" if sniper (a title no less) looses it's luster. I'm not saying that we should take every thing that a compony says is true, I'm saying that you should take a look at where you post you opinion. If this was on PB or any other forum that doesn't support sniping, then I probably wouldn't care. It's like me going onto a paint ball forum and saying paint ball is a sport from hell. I'll admit that I'm new to paint ball, only been doing it for two years, but you cant discredit my opinion because of that. I would like to hear your logic behind why you think snipers cannot exist in paint ball. Here's all the arguments you and others have put forth as to why you all are right: my experience makes me right, I haven't met any one who can do it, you can't train for it, you can't shoot as far as real snipers, and it's just a title. the rest of it has been statements that try to discredit others. Also notice no one has called them selves a REAL sniper, we call our selves PAINT BALL SNIPERS. So far you haven't shown any empirical evidence as to why paint ball snipers can't exist. You've only put forth shaky and opinion based evidence. I'd really like it if you, and others, stopped insulting people to get you point across. This is a debate over paint ball snipers existence, not personal battles. Lets make this a real solid debate. From this point forth I would like to see FACTS.
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#23 User is offline   alexspawn3000 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 05:14 PM

Quote

it's not so much the man or the rifle, so much as the skills and techniques applied. And distance is an element of stealth.


well said! err...typed
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#24 User is offline   alexspawn3000 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 05:16 PM

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Also notice no one has called them selves a REAL sniper, we call our selves PAINT BALL SNIPERS


I consider hunting a 1,500 bull elk in the mountains with a 7 mag sniping :). That's a gun that really makes a bang! Imagine those skills being put to use if the country got invaded per say? OMG... A SNIPER!...WITH A 7MAG! (7mm Remington rifle) B)



P.S OMG Tyger, I think you just revived the Special Ops forums! hahaha

This post has been edited by alexspawn3000: 11 August 2011 - 05:18 PM

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#25 User is offline   Cuy'val Dar  

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 05:35 PM

I hunt with a 7mag. LOVE IT! and it would appear that he has revived the forum! somewhat
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#26 User is offline   reef geek 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 05:38 PM

View Postalexspawn3000, on 11 August 2011 - 05:16 PM, said:

Quote

Also notice no one has called them selves a REAL sniper, we call our selves PAINT BALL SNIPERS


I consider hunting a 1,500 bull elk in the mountains with a 7 mag sniping :). That's a gun that really makes a bang! Imagine those skills being put to use if the country got invaded per say? OMG... A SNIPER!...WITH A 7MAG! (7mm Remington rifle) B)



P.S OMG Tyger, I think you just revived the Special Ops forums! hahaha


I could see that being called a real sniping since your doing the same thing as real snipers but it's just a different target, but in paint ball there are some larger differences like time frame and distance. I do like the way you put why paint ball snipers love what they do (even if you don't call it sniping). I just want tyger and others to stop insulting paint ball snipers, because we have a different way of playing that makes us happy doesn't mean you should hate on us.
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#27 User is offline   Chill_balla 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 05:51 PM

To a degree snipers exist, but they're not very useful... That guy running around with 10 billion dollars of gear and 1,00 bps, is laying down cover fire, scaring the !@#$ out of the other team, and probably getting more people out than the guy who crawls 12 hours to find out the game is over...
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#28 User is offline   Thalion 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 05:52 PM

View Postreef geek, on 11 August 2011 - 07:09 PM, said:

I'll admit that I'm new to paint ball, only been doing it for two years, but you cant discredit my opinion because of that. I would like to hear your logic behind why you think snipers cannot exist in paint ball.


Nobody's discrediting your opinion because you're new, just because you happen to be wrong. It's ok, it's happened a lot over the years - lots of newer players fall into the same traps you are and move on with experience.

Though when your first post is insulting a long-time member and contributor to the forum and the paintball community as a whole, you really discredited yourself.

You're asking people to write up explanations -- why don't you provide your logic what a paintball sniper is. Vortex posted a definition, so he gave it a try. His problem was his definition wasn't adequate and could easily be applied to all paintball players.


Looking forward to the video Tyger.
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#29 User is offline   Warpaint 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 05:54 PM

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So 20+ years practical experience is nothing for you guys, huh?

I've been married for 31 years, but I doubt my "experience" makes me an expert. Just because I've been married for longer than most of the yahoos here have been alive, don't expect me to dispense any marriage counseling...I credit it mostly to being a survivor!


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#30 User is offline   Warpaint 

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 06:28 PM

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To a degree snipers exist, but they're not very useful... That guy running around with 10 billion dollars of gear and 1,00 bps, is laying down cover fire, scaring the !@#$ out of the other team, and probably getting more people out than the guy who crawls 12 hours to find out the game is over...


Volvos are considered one of the safest cars in the world, but placing an inexperienced driver behind the wheel isn't going to make that person a safe driver. We could all own Barrett .50 caliber rifles and ghillie suits, and none of us would necessarily be a sniper. Effective marketing can make people believe that simply owning the same gear as the "pros" is going to improve their game and deliver similar results, but it takes some natural ability and practice to achieve the desired results. From time to time in Southern California, some mentally disturbed whack job dresses in nothing more than a t-shirt and their faded jeans, climbs to the top of a hill near a freeway, takes a few pot-shots at the cars below with a .22 rifle, and when a couple of cars swerve to the shoulder, he slips away back down the hill from the direction he came. Guess what everyone calls that guy? And obviously, he's been "practicing" somewhere. Sniping is a guerrilla combat technique of striking the enemy without intending to engage in direct and prolonged combat. Again, it's not the weapon or field equipment that makes one a sniper, it's the technique of engagement. Here at SO, sniper is one of the positions they promote to sell gear and the game, but merely owning and wearing the gear for any position is not going to guarantee success...that comes with ability, practice, commitment, and dedication. Recipe for disillusionment? Throwing down lots of money on gear to "buy" some status or achievement, but failing to pay your dues and put in the hours of practice to earn the desired distinction, and giving up in frustration when you find out success is something you work at and earn, not slip on like a pair of boots. That's one of the big reasons you see so many poor sportsmen out there...they're not seeing the return on their investment, so they get frustrated and lose their cool. Problem is, they are investing dollars, when they should be working on building some sweat equity.

This post has been edited by Warpaint: 11 August 2011 - 06:30 PM

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