But seriously, Im not entirely sure I deserved to be ranted at like that (although I generally enjoy reading some of yours - sharp & articulate. I just like them better when they're not pointed at ME).
Despite the "Amen", I am not now, nor have I ever been a Christian. Im an Athiest. "Amen" just takes less time to type than "I agree with you". Sorry for the confusion...Its just an expression to me.
If you like, feel free to re-write the first third of your last post, but without the Christan references - Im curious what you might come up with...
Not a rant, and not directed at YOU, but YOUR criticism of my comment. Note that I removed YOUR name from the quote I selected. Also, note that my first post in this thread was not directed to anyone here, just MY OPINION on the topic...Hillary Clinton, which my post was specifically directed to. I have no intention of re-writing my posts, but if you like, you can go back and re-read mine, and catch the points you missed or neglected on the first pass. And if this side-bar discussion makes you uncomfortable, you should note that it was YOU that initiated it, not I. For emphasis, I even capitalized my OPINION in my original and subsequent posts. I don't expect people here to agree with or be influenced by MY OPINION, and since I have no real connection to anyone here, nor do I particularly care. I realize not everyone here is against Hillary Clinton, and I have nothing personal against her myself (Bill cheated, not her, however she has accepted it...which ties to my point about declining standards, etc.), but I definitely have my reservations with regards to her intentions for the White House. Again, I find it difficult to believe she is going to put the White House in order, when she couldn't manage her own. Her marriage IS her personal business, but within the context I have stated, it says something about her moral character TO ME. I am looking at more than the image she projects on TV. She is willing to tolerate a dog in her house humping her company's legs, so long as she remains the hostess of the party. It is an inconsistency between what she SAYS, and what she DOES, which are true indicators of character. In MY OPINION, the Clinton marriage is a facade, but not uncommon in politics, as recent headlines would tend to indicate. We expect these things from political figures these days. We shrug it off, with a "Yeah, so? So and so did it, too." Hence my comment about declining standards, expectations, etc.
I surely have no quarrel with you, I know nothing about you, nor you me, which makes it very presumptuous of you to criticize my views on the Clinton marriage and the hardships that face any marriage, when you don't know anything about me. Failed marriages don't happen by accident, they happen from neglect, and poor decisions. If the Clintons didn't want their personal business in the public eye, then 1.) they shouldn't be public officials, and 2.) they better keep their personal business off the radar. Bill knew that, but his judgment was clouded by personal desires. His infidelity was intentional, and he knew it was wrong. He didn't come home late from work one night and find Monica in his bed by some mistake, he took her into a White House bathroom when no one was looking and dropped his pants. He knew what he was doing, he knew it was wrong, he knew the risks, he thought he could get away with it, and because it was bad, he hid this relationship and later lied about it...so what does that tell us about his value of his marriage? His character? And has Hillary forgiven that, or condoned it? Is it because she loves him so and treasures her marriage, or because he is a stepping stone on the way to the White House?
My statement regarding the use of "Amen" was just another point regarding declining standards and expectations, not an invitation to discuss religion or debate anyone's Christianity. Nor do I wish to discuss the philosophies of the Catholic church or Jesus. Those topics are out of bounds for the forum anyway, and NO ONE here possesses the credentials to have a vaild theological discussion anyway...look where we are. My point is that by using "Amen" in general conversations, it has been relegated to little more than "I agree", "Uh-huh", "Ditto", or "Yup", or as you say, just an "expression", which again ties to my point about declining standards, expectations, etc. A meaningful word associated with prayers and spirituality has been reduced (not maliciously or intentionally...and it doesn't bother me that people use it that way) to little more than a colorful metaphor. But we "understand" that. Again, we live in an age of declining standards, expectations, etc. We expect increasingly less of people, accept or accommodate serious character flaws, condone neglectful failures, and unfortunately, people seem to be developing a trend of living down to expectations. That may be okay for some people, but not for the people we select to be our leaders, for where they go, we shall follow. Perhaps, and perhaps not.
Edit: I forgot to say thank you for the compliment, Stuntman. I find your posts to reflect a fairly balanced and sensical perspective to life and things in general, including more meaningful things like paintball, when we occasionally discuss that topic in this forum. I apologize if I seemed like I was ranting. It was not my intention to insult or affront you. I feel very strongly about moral responsibility and personal accountability, and I guess that comes across a little strongly at times. I am tolerant and accepting of "everyday" people's inadequacies and some weaknesses, but not among the people who presume to call themselves our leaders. They gotta show me something better than that.
This post has been edited by Warpaint: 08 August 2007 - 06:51 PM